as if medical marijuana wasnt bad enough...

[BarryG]

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=3933999

can you believe this???

[DesertFox]

I agree with the magmom. There are times the damn govt just shouldn't look too closely at such situations. That doesn't mean we should legalize this or that; just that no govt policy can fit the nearly infinite ways reality shits on us. It's nuts to refuse a dying or very sick person something that can ease his pain when nothing else works, even if it is illegal.

[BarryG]

it started the same way with pot, first they just wanted to give it to dying people, now anyone with a headache or a stubbed toe can get it in california.

[Conserv_Atticus]

Oh yes lets give dying cancer patients "E" so they can "screw" as many people as they can before they die.

[Rink]

CA thats a little harsh, i dont think cancer patients are gonna be in any mood to 'screw' anyone, not in the condition they are in with the last stages of Cancer.

be a little more understanding willya?

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

I believe we are pharmaceudically advanced enough in this country, in this day and age, to be able to provide adequate "pain meds" or "anxiety calmers" without having to resort to recreational drugs such as ecstasy and marijuana. I have a very hard time believing no other medicinal offering known to man cannot achieve the same results as these two particular drugs.

However, I am not a physician, nor have I any medical training or instruction. I believe medical decisions such as these, should be discussed on an individual basis between patients, family, and medical practitioners. I don't know of a single case where anyone would sue a doctor for giving a drug which eased pain, most certainly at the brink of death. I do not, however, think blanket "lifting" of the outlawed status of certain drugs should occur.

[rudeguy]

I've got to take issue with your statement, HSRU. I also don't think we should just legalize all drugs, but you have to remember that the line between recreational and medical drugs is quite fine. Every hospital carries many different opiates, in addition to other hard drugs. There isn't that big a difference between heroin, morphine, codeine, oxycontin, etc.

I think a lot of people make the mistake of believing that the drugs that doctors use are somehow safer or less dangerous than those that are used recreationally. They are all similar substances, which can be helpful when used responsibly and dangerous when abused. I think doctors should be allowed to prescribe what they feel is necesary for the patient, regardless of the drug's recreational potential.

[BarryG]

the best thing you can give to a terminally ill person is a Bible.

[BEST45CAL]

My mother was on morphine and methadone for a few weeks before she passed. Doc wrote her script for it. She had terminal liver cancer which is violently painful. Toward the end, mother was so weak that she couldn't speak or open her eyes. When it was time for her to go, she just went to sleep and never woke up. The methadone and morphine helped to make her last weeks very comfortable.

[washoeconservative]

I believe we are pharmaceudically advanced enough in this country, in this day and age, to be able to provide adequate "pain meds" or "anxiety calmers" without having to resort to recreational drugs such as ecstasy and marijuana
I could be wrong, and if I am, someone please correct me quickly, but isnt ecstasy a "pharmaceudically advanced" drug? It would seem to me that the only difference between ecstasy and other hard drugs is the club/youth desire to abuse it and use it for other purposes in the public view. Truth is... people do the same these days with any major pain killer or anxiety drugs.

[CzechPrince]

the best thing you can give to a terminally ill person is a Bible.
Maybe, but these people don't want a bible, they want some X!!!


On a separate note, My grandfather who died (was not even Catholic, my mom's dad) requested a scapular and rosary at his death bed while my mom talked about heaven, I still cry when I think about it:Crying:

[CzechPrince]

If these people are DYING, and they are not harming anyone and want some X, let them have some!!! I wouldn't care if it was heroin even.

As a Libertarian, you know I am totally for legalizing mary jane, obviously I do not support legalizing X or heroin, but for a last request if they can get it, why should anyone, especially the federal government, have a say in that?

[DesertFox]

I'm for repealing all laws prohibiting any kind of drug, currently legal or not, to include coke, crack, heroin, LSD, steroids, whatever. To balance that out, we also need to get rid of the "social nets" that enable the idiots who use that crap -- you know, the needle programs, the halfway houses, all of it. Let they who abuse dope die on the street and lie there til they stink. When kids see the first-hand results of using dope, they won't need to be preached to, thrown in jail, medicated or anything else. They'll figure it out on their own. If they don't, they'll remove themselves from the gene pool and the human race will be better for it.

Then doctors treating the terminally ill, those in acute chronic pain and others in hopeless situations can do what seems the right thing, without going to jail. Also, several hundred billion bucks can be diverted from the War on Drugs to my pocket and I'll be a rich man.

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

However, I am not a physician, nor have I any medical training or instruction. I believe medical decisions such as these, should be discussed on an individual basis between patients, family, and medical practitioners. I don't know of a single case where anyone would sue a doctor for giving a drug which eased pain, most certainly at the brink of death. I do not, however, think blanket "lifting" of the outlawed status of certain drugs should occur. I beleive my words above stand. Illegal drus are illegal drugs because they should NOT be available in the "outside" market . . . outside of a doctor prescribed regimine. I believe patient care, in relation to medicine, should be between doctor and patient, most especially and specifically when it comes to the terminally ill, chronically ill, and legitimate medical conditions. This should be a seperate issue from blanket legalization of otherwise illegal drugs.

Illegal drugs are illegal drugs also because others are effected when they are used for NON-medical (i.e. recreational) purposes. Joe can do marijuana all his life, have no "serious" side effects that alter his life, UNTIL the day he gets in a car, his reflex time is subdued as he swerves to miss the dog in the road and hits 5 year old Cindy riding her bike down the sidewalk. There is increased risk for harm to others when individuals take illegal substances --- and I am including alcohol, even though I know it is legal.

Go ahead, make it legal. All the arguments for it will never satisfy the mother of a dead child, the wife of a dead husband, or the father left with his chldren from his dead wife. I have been both partaker and enjoyer of, as well as victim of others who have partaken. I am not now, nor do I forsee being, in favor of lifting the existing laws regarding illegal substances.

[Rink]

The catch with giving extasy or heroin or any other 'illegal' drug to a terminally ill patient is, someone else could get their paws on their medicines.

Think, home invasions, or thefts of terminally ill people who get targeted by the criminal element for free illegal drugs because the medical establishment gives those drugs to them.

Think, joe or jane caretaker who may be taking care of the terminally ill patient, they may be tempted to snitch the illegal drugs either for a habit or the monetary value on the street, since many caretakers arent paied diddly for the work they do.

Think of family who may have access to the terminally ill's home and possibly medicines, how on earth are you going to ensure those illegal drugs dont get into the hands of the wrong person??

See, too many problems exist with allowing the terminally ill drugs that are patently illegal like exctasy or heroin or whatnot.

[Rink]

usually most terminally ill have a nurse practicioner to give intravenous morphine, otherwise its in pill form only.

Morphine is only one medicine, but to have extacy or heroin or whatnot, just makes it too tempting a target for others to steal, for use or resell on the streets, since its a hot item, much more than morphine is its more liable to be stolen and re-sold on the streets for money or used by those wanting the illicit drug for their own pleasure without the price tag attached on the street.

You cite only morphine but these others are wanting extacy to be allowed, its very very tempting for those who know, to steal such drugs and resell it on the streets.

What would be done is a creation of a black market funnel, an easier way to get the drug than ever before.

Yes I am aware of the incredible amount of drugs being stolen and resold on the black market for money.

but why add to it?

(just playing devils advocate here)

[rudeguy]

Magnummom, you get my vote for post of the month. That post was phenomenal.


Sure Rink.. that may be true but we already are allowed as care givers to administer morphine at home for our dying family member. More and more are choosing death at home, a place they are familiar with and to be with loved ones. well those loved ones are the ones that have these drugs in their home and give them daily, numerous times to loved ones. so as valid as your concerns are.. it's already been going on for years and years. I know that you are heavily watched with each perscription.. if you are broken into and they are stolen that is sad.... but the same care is given as one would if you have a gun at home.. and someone breaks in and steals that and commits a crime with it.

IF we already have them available and are giving them at home.. then what difference does it make what drugs we give the dying???? The medical field right now is having some serious issues with drugs being stolen and re sold on the market. Even as heavily locked up as they are and watched they are still being stolen in amounts that would astound you. I hear the stories from those that work closely with them.

[PrezLeefun]

it started the same way with pot, first they just wanted to give it to dying people, now anyone with a headache or a stubbed toe can get it in california.you know thats is crap.

[PrezLeefun]

medical marijuana is a gift for those who are dying in pain. some meds cant help the pain well enough, and others (vioxx) kill you. Smoke weed, die in peace. sounds fine to me.

My mom used to beg my grandmother to smoke a joint instead doin all that chemo back in the 80's that chemo B.S. killed you faster. it certianly killed her, and she was pain every step of the way.

[Sinanju]

Prez, I am on your side but...


Barry G. is right... go to San Francisco on any monday... on mondays, the "weed" clinics hand out happy sacks to all the homeless people... all you need is a prescription and you can get that for a headache..

A friend who lives there has gotten some for me from those "clinics" for his "migraine"....

and they have some good weed in those stores...

But, I am for complete drug de-legalization..

"I'm for repealing all laws prohibiting any kind of drug, currently legal or not, to include coke, crack, heroin, LSD, steroids, whatever. To balance that out, we also need to get rid of the "social nets" that enable the idiots who use that crap -- you know, the needle programs, the halfway houses, all of it. Let they who abuse dope die on the street and lie there til they stink. When kids see the first-hand results of using dope, they won't need to be preached to, thrown in jail, medicated or anything else. They'll figure it out on their own. If they don't, they'll remove themselves from the gene pool and the human race will be better for it."

The BEST way to get rid of the democrats as a political party is allow them to destroy themselves.... and believe me, with legalized drugs they would.....

[Sinanju]

ALSO...


I find it hilarious that almost nobody here will defend a government school but they will go down with the ship for a government hospital....


You can home-school but not home-hospital, huh?

Teachers cannot tell your children about sex but Doctors can give you any drug they get a kickback for?

2000 yr old religious words have merit but 47 thousand year old holistic medicine doesn't?

I find it funny that recent reports have the vitamin B-17 as the cure for cancer where all our advanced chemicals and radiation only serve to kill the patient SLOWER..... Imagine that! and we didn't even have to create B-17... for whatever reason, it seems to have been put here for our health use by some higher power... almost god-like if you will.....

Gee, I wonder... Marijuana is a seed bearing plant... suposedly, the bible tells us that seed bearing plants were put here for our use by GOD....

Are you against god?

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

ALSO...


I find it hilarious that almost nobody here will defend a government school but they will go down with the ship for a government hospital....


You can home-school but not home-hospital, huh?

Teachers cannot tell your children about sex but Doctors can give you any drug they get a kickback for?I am quite sure you weren't addressing that to me, but I will answer as I fall into your "category" listed above. I will NOT go down with the ship for a government hospital -- we use quite a lot of homeopathic remedies, and such. I am all for doing what WORKS, and a lot of the times it has quite a bit to do with fooling the brain. Happy, loved, content people do better will treatments, for ANYTHING than sad, lonley, miserable people. I do believe attitude plays a big part in health.

That said, I am NOT for legalizing illegal drugs. They are illegal for a reason -- they are extremely dangerous outside the realm of a medical professional. You let just one person go this route and a kid get a hold of some pill, injection, or whatever -- they will sue EVERYONE in the wake of that awful accident.

IF a medical profession PRESCRIBES marijuana for a terminally ill patient under some type of guidelines or procedures, I have no problem with it. Same with any other "illegal" drug, IF a medical professional is overseeing its use. I just don't believe we should abandon all sense of right and wrong because there is one small area that is in a positive light.

We know kids are going to drink -- do we abolish drinking age laws? We know people are going to run lights and signs -- do we abolish all traffic laws? Nope, I am NOT for legalizing drugs to the public.

As for the docs with the drug kickbacks --- better take on the insurance companies and the personal injury lawyers. They are the ones stopping NEW drugs from getting the market in the US. Outrageous lawsuits, exorbitant insurance rates, fraud, that's where most of the problems lie. We might have GREAT drugs to do BETTER things than "medical marijuana" if it weren't for these problems.

[washoeconservative]

IF a medical profession PRESCRIBES marijuana for a terminally ill patient under some type of guidelines or procedures, I have no problem with it. Same with any other "illegal" drug, IF a medical professional is overseeing its use. I just don't believe we should abandon all sense of right and wrong because there is one small area that is in a positive light.
Yeah that!

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

Yeah you can get medical marijuana for migraines in Oreogn and washington as well, as long as you have tried other meds and they did not work. Personally in the past I have been on other meds for migraines and they made me real sick and they had horrible side effects as well as I could not take ibprofin, aspirin or antihistamines while taking these meds because most other emds interacted with them and would possibly kill you. Not to mention most of these meds did not work anyway.
Obviously many of you do not suffer from migraines, I have been told to try marijuana but I will not. I have gotten them since I was 12 years old and I have a severe headache almsot 24/7 and I get a migraine at least once a week I do not get them that often anymore but I do at least twice a month usually more where I get dizzy, vomit and sometimes even black out. There is nothing wrong they have ran several tests on me, and there is a family history of migraines in my familyso they said it is hereditary and I have to outgrow them, and well after 10 years I have learned to deal with it, but not everyone is that strong and there has been times where I have wanted to try pot because they have been so bad, but I have not.
I have no problem with anyone that goes through what I go through getting pot if it helps them.

Just an aside ... kitten, I have suffered with migraines all my life -- my earliest memory of a migraine was at the age of 5. I am light sensitive, I get extremely nauseous (usually vomit), and seek dark, cool, damp places when they occur. I have had brain scans, EEG's, tons of tests, and the same results as you . . . nothing wrong with me (supposedly).
Quite by accident, I found out what was causing mine. I am allergic to chocolate (of all things!) Ever since I was a little girl having these horrible, horrible headaches, I have always taken whatever medication available at the time (when I was young, it was Bayer Aspirin, later it became Tylenol and Ibuprofen) with a large glass of chocolate milk -- even when I was very young, my mom used to put three spoonfuls of Nestle' Quick in a cup, ad a little water to make a chocolate paste, and put my aspirin in it and I would eat it taking the aspirin down with the chocolate. Imagine my surprise at finding out what was causing all the pain!

I stumbled across a diet for migraine sufferers -- a friend actually gave it to me. Now I am not faithful to sticking to it, because there are A LOT of no-no's on it that I absolutely love. But I did strictly stick to it for 2 solid weeks, during which time I had not a single migraine.

I say all that to say this -- it could be something in your diet triggering your migraines. Just a thought, and maybe you might want to cut out some things for a couple of weeks and just see what happens. I have been realtively migraine free now for over 4 years. I still have my stash of Imitrex samples, just in case I get the "big one" but so far, so good, and I do try to limit the no-no's as best I can, which I think has absolutely saved my quality of life.

[Sinanju]

"Quite by accident, I found out what was causing mine. I am allergic to chocolate (of all things!)"



My mother-in-law also is allergic to chocolate and if she eats it she gets a horrible migraine...


Perhaps you should cut out chocolate for a week Kitten or see if there is something else you are eating that you are allergic too..


Chocolate and sugar are highly addictive drugs.. Should they be banned Homeschool? Afterall, science is swiftly proving there ill effects.... That is your argument isnt it? Shouldn't we also outlaw McDonalds as well?

[Kathy29]

Denying medical marijuana to the terminally ill makes no sense at all. It simply doesn't. We would deny marijuana but give them oxycontin. And this is sensible? We would deny them marijuana but prescribe morphine. Is this sensible?

No. Of course not.

By the way, morphine is a form of heroin so in effect we're already giving heroin.

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

Chocolate and sugar are highly addictive drugs.. Should they be banned Homeschool? Afterall, science is swiftly proving there ill effects.... That is your argument isnt it? Shouldn't we also outlaw McDonalds as well?

I don't know what you have against me, but you can cut the snide tone -- I will be glad to answer your question, though you needn't get so smart about it.

I wasn't aware that chocolate was addictive -- I know I love it, I will eat it when and if I can, but now that I know its effects on my body I have almost completely cut it out of my life, and if it were gone forever, no big dea.

I don't think I have ever heard of a case of a vehicular accident due to someone being under the influence of chocolate or a Big Mac. Illegal drugs are ALREADY illegal for a reason. My argument is to keep what is illegal, illegal, because it is so for a reason -- harmful results to MORE than just the person who takes them. To compare marijuana, cocaine, herione, or other highly dangerous drugs to chocolate and fast-food is simply ridiculous.

[Sinanju]

"I don't know what you have against me"


Absolutely nothing milady, forgive me if I seem to have a grudge... it was not my intent..



My simple point is that doctors perscribed deadly drugs every day.... they are able to do this simply because the federal government and private pharmsuetical companies can make a buck...

Also, I am(like others here) willing to let people deal with the consequences of their actions... therefore I am for drug legalisation as well as a vast cutback in social services....


Wanna be a crackhead... here is the crack and a lighter... smoke up buddy....


Wanna be a pothead.. here is the bong and a lighter and twinkie... smoke up buddy...






The people who are able and willing to live their lives drug free ALREADY do..... The ones who want to be addicts ARE....

[BarryG]

Denying medical marijuana to the terminally ill makes no sense at all. It simply doesn't. We would deny marijuana but give them oxycontin. And this is sensible? We would deny them marijuana but prescribe morphine. Is this sensible?

No. Of course not.

By the way, morphine is a form of heroin so in effect we're already giving heroin.

first of all, medicine is not something you smoke. second, oxycontin is made ina lab, so they can measure doses properly. with something you buy on the street or grows in the ground, no telling what kind of poison it might be. there are plenty of medications out there that can help without resorting to illegal dope.

[CzechPrince]

IT's a PLANT! The first medications were made of plants and herbal remedies. The only reason it is illegal is because the federal government deems it so, and claims it's "Bad".

[Sinanju]

Is it "illegal" dope if it is perscribed and regulated by a physician in a state that ALLOWS it to be perscribed as such?


Many medical marijuana users EAT it instead of smoking it....

If the effects of marijuana could be recreated in a lab and a drug company was able to make money off the synth-weed... then it wouldn't be illegal...


Many things throughout the hisory of humanity have been illegal when they should have been legal and vice versa...



I still marvel that "conservatives" would argue so stridently AGAINST state rights... I thought you people wanted a smaller federal govt and a more involved state govt.... guess you are not truly "conservative" afterall.... at least when it comes to wacky weed..


Abortion or Gay marriage is a different matter though isn't it?

[Sinanju]

"No that is not the only reason it's illegal... because it's bad. One reason they deem it so... and it's probably the biggest reason they keep it illegal is because they have not found a way to tax it where they can make as much off of it as they can in the war on drugs property confiscation laws."


Ding Ding Ding!!!

We have ANOTHER winner! Like I just said.. if the govt. or a large coporation can make a buck off of it it would be legal.. but average, everyday, "brown-thumb" americans can GROW their own medicine and that is a NO-NO in this day and age!

[CzechPrince]

Who knows where the money is going. I mean for crying out loud there was like over 10 billion dollars UNACCOUNTED FOR in the Education budget one year while Clinton was in office. And it probably was not even Clinton's fault, the government has just become so beureacratic and large that it is impossible for them to keep track of anything.

[DesertFox]

Only in the Clinton Administration would a $10-billion loss go unreported and uninvestigated. Silence made that possible. Had it happened on W's watch, the print media would be howling with indignation, liberal Senators would come to the floor with ropes in hand and nightly tv would speak of nothing else for weeks.

[CzechPrince]

:smash:What this thread has taught us, though, in partnership with :smash:
the US Federal Government's total waste of time and tax payer money on the failed war on drugs......ladies and gentlemen.....





:thumb: !!!WEED IS TO GOOD TO BE ILLEGAL!!!:thumb:

http://www.marijuanaaddiction.info/img/weed%20plants.jpg


WHOSE GOT THE MUNCHIES?!?!?!?!

:munch: :munch: :munch:

Please use Responsibly so we can get the government out of our Wallets and our Personal Lives!!!!!!!!!!!

[CzechPrince]

I think the funny thing about that was I am not even a pot-head.....

[PrezLeefun]

I think the funny thing about that was I am not even a pot-head.....

rotflmao:devilange

[Peachdiane]

have had brain scans, EEG's, tons of tests, and the same results as you . . . nothing wrong with me (supposedly).

Whoo-eee! I'm glad you found the trigger! Mine are sinus related. Some mornings I'd wake up partially blind, nauseous, and dizzy. The surgeon said surgery would help but only short term so I nixed it. Now at bedtime I take Flonase and Congestac and I have been ok since then. (Knock wood)

Speaking of chocolate, Ty used to break out in a rash and get flushed. fortunately, it didn't take long to find the cuplrit since he isn't partial to chocolate anyway.