Many going to college are not ready, report says

[DesertFox]

Tamar Lewin
The New York Times
17 Aug 05

Only about half of this year's high school graduates have the reading skills they need to succeed in college, and even fewer are prepared for college-level science and math courses, according to a yearly report from ACT, which produces one of the nation's leading college admissions tests.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/08/17/education/17scores_chart_lg.gif

The report, based on scores of the 2005 high school graduates who took the exam, some 1.2 million students in all, also found that fewer than one in four met the college-readiness benchmarks in all four subjects tested: reading comprehension, English, math and science.

"It is very likely that hundreds of thousands of students will have a disconnect between their plans for college and the cold reality of their readiness for college," Richard L. Ferguson, chief executive of ACT, said in an online news conference yesterday.

ACT sets its college-readiness benchmarks - including the reading comprehension benchmark, which is new this year - by correlating earlier students' ACT scores with grades they actually received as college freshmen. Based on that data, the benchmarks indicate the skill level at which a student has a 70 percent likelihood of earning a C or better, and a 50 percent chance of earning a B or better.

[DesertFox]

Rather than dropping standards, colleges need to establish either a prep school or a fifth year for students who don't measure up academically at the start. That would be a real fix, and one that the colleges should welcome since it would mean more money for them.

[cerberus]

Rather than dropping standards, colleges need to establish either a prep school or a fifth year for students who don't measure up academically at the start. That would be a real fix, and one that the colleges should welcome since it would mean more money for them.

No they shouldn't. Why is it the college's problem if the students either failed to learn or weren't taught properly. Most college's are private and if you don't measure up to their standards I sure as hell hope they fail those kids out.
If you are going to establish an extra "fifth year" anywhere, then do it at the High School level.

[DesertFox]

It's the college's problem because nobody in the colleges has the balls to resist lowering standards. This is a fix that would work. A fifth year of high school wouldn't be accepted by anybody.

[Tumblehome]

Keep standards where they are and simply don't let people in who do not meet the standards. Enrolment may drop off for a while but it is worth it.

Also, this is yet another reason why the evolution vs creation in school science classes debate should be moot. Don't teach either. Teach the kids to read!

Really though I think the anti-education culture is to blame. We have the same here in Canada. Kids simply don't like going to school. School isn't cool. Japanese kids have the exact opposite view, taken to an unhealthy extreme. These kids actually kill themselves over bad grades.

[Trevelyan]

Well, those are based on the scores of a standardized test. I know people who get straight A's, yet do not do well at all on any of these standardized exams.

It is just kind of difficult to accurately predict who will do well in college and who will not based on ACT or SAT scores.

Now if you compare the standardized scores with their high school grades, and they both are not up to snuff, then the person could most likely be labeled as "unprepared."

[tacitus]

Rather than dropping standards, colleges need to establish either a prep school or a fifth year for students who don't measure up academically at the start. That would be a real fix, and one that the colleges should welcome since it would mean more money for them.

I disagree. The cry from the NEA is 'Give us more money and we'll improve the scores.' Well we did and they didn't.

Why should tax supported higher education institutions have to spend more tax dollars to fix when the clows in lower edication screwed up? Isn't the tax payer getting raped enough without resorting to more taxes?

The parents whould be outraged and they need to take the necessary steps to hold the fools in the local school administration accountable.

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

Rather than dropping standards, colleges need to establish either a prep school or a fifth year for students who don't measure up academically at the start. That would be a real fix, and one that the colleges should welcome since it would mean more money for them.

Fox, I think you are on the right track, just the wrong train, LOL. I like the idea of a "fifth year" instution of higher learning. It's a great niche opportunity for the free market. Someone could start an option school (alternate to community college), to assist those students who didn't get what they needed from the government schools. It could be TRULY student and parent driven, since participation is voluntary, and it is NOT a government school, NOR is it a degree program, but instead an educational assistance organization.

[DesertFox]

Keep standards where they are and simply don't let people in who do not meet the standards. Enrolment may drop off for a while but it is worth it.I see you don't live in America. When they kept the standards, blacks didn't qualify in "appropriate" numbers and colleges were accused of racism. The colleges then lowered standards.

It is just kind of difficult to accurately predict who will do well in college and who will not based on ACT or SAT scores. I see you know nothing about this. SAT scores do a remarkable job of predicting how people will do in college. Go pick up a copy of The Bell Curve and inform yourself.

I disagree. The cry from the NEA is 'Give us more money and we'll improve the scores.' Well we did and they didn't. The NEA is grade school and high school. I'm talking college.

Why should tax supported higher education institutions have to spend more tax dollars to fix when the clows in lower edication screwed up? Isn't the tax payer getting raped enough without resorting to more taxes?They won't -- the kids who need that fifth year will.

The parents whould be outraged and they need to take the necessary steps to hold the fools in the local school administration accountable. Yeah. And how well has that worked? It hasn't. I'm proposing something that has been shown to work (in the military academies). Nothing else that has been tried has worked. Doing nothing workable is exactly what will happen if we don't try this.

[Aric2000]

Fox, I think you are on the right track, just the wrong train, LOL. I like the idea of a "fifth year" instution of higher learning. It's a great niche opportunity for the free market. Someone could start an option school (alternate to community college), to assist those students who didn't get what they needed from the government schools. It could be TRULY student and parent driven, since participation is voluntary, and it is NOT a government school, NOR is it a degree program, but instead an educational assistance organization.

Wouldn't that be nice, but the NEA and their cronies would have a complete and TOTAL meltdown.

If it has to do with education, and they can't control it, then it will have a real short life.

The whole system needs to be torn down, and started over from scratch, the feds and the states need to stay OUT of it, and let the counties and cities deal with their own educational needs.

And privatising it would make the BIGGEST difference of ANY of it.

I am for school vouchers as a middle thing, that way parents can get their kids out of failing schools, and into private schools, and FOR PROFIT schools would start popping up, etc, etc.

This would start the REAL process of closing down the public schools, and start a REAL educational system in this country.

[DesertFox]

:claps:

Well said, Aric.

[Trevelyan]

I see you know nothing about this. SAT scores do a remarkable job of predicting how people will do in college. Go pick up a copy of The Bell Curve and inform yourself.


Well, from my personal experience, the SAT has not correlated to success in college for people I know.

[Melz]

Well, from my personal experience, the SAT has not correlated to success in college for people I know.

In a sense, it may not. Self control is another factor which determines how well someone does in college. SAT scores determine their potential. Success is not potential based.

[DesertFox]

The SAT correlates highly with success in college. That's not the same thing as success in life.

[Trevelyan]

The SAT correlates highly with success in college. That's not the same thing as success in life.

Ok, but I said "succes in college." <O:p</O:p
<O:p</O:p

The SAT may do so, but all I am saying is that I have never seen this trend first hand really. <O:p</O:p

[Hudson]

Regarding DesertFox's suggestion that a 5th college year be introduced:
With the excessive cost of college these days, would you not fear that fewer people would then be able to afford to go to college, forcing colleges to lower their standards even more to ensure that they fill the classes and to stay financially solvent?


.

[DesertFox]

Nope.

[Hudson]

So you don't think that increasing the cost of getting an education by 20% (before interest on those college loans) would make college financially unattainable for anyone?
You don't think that if less people can afford to go to college that college enrollment will drop?
You don't think that colleges will respond to a drop in numbers/cashflow by allowing less qualified candidates who are in a better financial situation to enroll?

If you do not believe these things, please tell me why, becaus based on my experiences, I honestly believe this would be the case.

[star2589]

No they shouldn't. Why is it the college's problem if the students either failed to learn or weren't taught properly. Most college's are private and if you don't measure up to their standards I sure as hell hope they fail those kids out.
If you are going to establish an extra "fifth year" anywhere, then do it at the High School level.

well, colleges certainly shouldn't graduate students that dont meet the requirements, but I see nothing wrong with colleges trying to fill in the gaps that are left in highschool.