Senator: Concerned shuttle crew took pictures of wing

[oracle]

Senator: Concerned shuttle crew took pictures of wing (http://www.floridatoday.com/columbia/020503brown.htm)

Associated Press

ARLINGTON, Va. -- Crew members of the space shuttle Columbia were concerned about the orbiter's damaged left wing, according to Sen. George Allen, R-Va.

One of the crew members, mission specialist David Brown, sent e-mail messages to his brother Doug during the mission, Allen said. In those e-mails, David Brown said that the crew took pictures of the left wing because they were concerned about it, Allen said.

The senator was only repeating information he received from Doug Brown, said his spokeswoman, Carrie Cantrell. There was no phone listing for Doug Brown’s home in Arlington and he could not be reached for comment today.

A 2½-pound chunk of insulation foam struck the underside of the wing during liftoff as the shuttle sped upward at 1,900 mph last month. At the time, NASA officials did not think the damage would be a problem, but the agency is now investigating the wing as a possible reason that Columbia shattered on re-entry into Earth’s atmosphere on Saturday.

NASA officials said the crew would probably not have been able to see or take pictures of the damaged part of the wing.

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Click here to read more (http://www.floridatoday.com/columbia/020503brown.htm)

[Chris]

[ QUOTE ]
“He talked about NASA, about how they cared about, for example, specifically, one of the culprits or suspected culprits in this tragedy, which was that piece of foam that hit the left wing,” Allen said.


[/ QUOTE ]

One of the culprits??? What are the other culprits that they suspect?

[Warlady]

I heard that chunk of foam was frozen which made it much heavier than just plain foam.

[Chris]

Since I posted that question I heard about this. Maybe that's what he was referring to.

NASA Backs Away From Theory Foam Was 'Root Cause' of Crash (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,77701,00.html)

SPACE CENTER, Houston — After days of analysis, NASA backed away Wednesday from the theory that a piece of foam that struck Columbia during liftoff was the root cause of the space shuttle's disintegration over Texas.

Shuttle program manager Ron Dittemore said investigators now are focusing more closely on the desperate effort of Columbia's automatic control system to hold the speed of the spacecraft stable despite an increasing level of wind resistance, or drag, on the left wing.

Dittemore said that after a careful study of the damage possible from the fall of a chunk of foam insulation that was believed to be 20 inches and 2 pounds, investigators are "looking somewhere else."

[Keith J]

The foam was ~8" by ~20", that is a given. Its weight and hardness are unknowns but from video I have seen, it was considerably more dense than 2.5 lbs....the tank is filled for at least 2 days in the Florida humidity. The open cells in the foam fill with water which freezes, reducing the elasticity and increasing the hardness and weight.

You can see the impact and resultant debris cloud...its significant.

[Warlady]

I saw that video too Keith. It created a huge spray of something. I don't think it should be discounted.

[SunnyBrook]

How much did they know...
...and when did they know it.
Most Likely, Crew Sensed Something Had Gone Wrong (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=68&e=13&u=/nyt/20030205/ts_nyt/most_likely__crew_sensed_something_had_gone_wrong)
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[Keith J]

[ QUOTE ]
Warlady said:
I saw that video too Keith. It created a huge spray of something. I don't think it should be discounted.

[/ QUOTE ]

They were moving at ~1900 MPH! That was pulverized thermal tile as its white underneath the black coating. Its chalky when pulverized.

Ever hit a small bird on the highway? Think what a 2-pound chunk of ice does when you are going 1900 MPH!

[DesertFox]

I remember that bird intercepting a Randy Johnson fastball last summer. Instant debris!

[Keith J]

The Big Unit really gained fans on that one! It was a Rock Dove AKA feral pidgeon...legal kill and good riddance.

Interestingly enough, the leading edges, windscreens and front of the orbiters all can withstand impacts from birds. The underbelly cannot as FOD was not expected and reentry was planned for a space-debris free area. No one planned for FOD on the belly at blast-off.

Here's some areodynamics...the orbiter is a flying wing and to keep the course vertical, it assumes an angle of attack in ascent that INCREASES the airstream velocity between the shuttle and the tank. From Bernoulli's equation, this would tend to SUCK debris toward the shuttle.

I sure hope the engineers can figure this out.

[Warlady]

Keith whoever is at fault for not solving the foam chunks problem should be tried for murder.

[DesertFox]

It's one of those curled-up ten dimensions, I tell ya.

[Warlady]

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[Keith J]

[ QUOTE ]
Warlady said:
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[/ QUOTE ]

String theory. Its a complex theoretical explaniation for space-time relationships. Too much for me...it won't make me any money either.

[Warlady]

Warlady still /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[Chris]

[ QUOTE ]
DesertFox said:
It's one of those curled-up ten dimensions, I tell ya.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have a good book on that I was about halfway through, but one of my son's friends who's studying physics in college borrowed it and won't give it back. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[DesertFox]

WL, according to (one version of) string theory, the universe began as 10 dimensions, with the four forces (gravity, etc) united as one. But it was unstable and blew apart. The four dimensions we know vastly dominated, while the other six curled up into teensy things the size of half-a-billionth-of-a-quark or so. In theory, those dimensions are still there, just too small for us to detect.

My joke was that a "quantum fluctuation" caused one of them dimensions momentarily to upsize at a bad moment and in a bad place.

[Keith J]

Theoretical quantum physics is there.:)