Excuse me? Where the hell is the media on the stock market?

[Warlady]

I'm waiting on the liberals to explain the stock market. I'm waiting. I'm waiting. How long do I have to wait you hypocrites? Oh come on. Let's hear it. Where are you?

[Etaoin]

Warlady, just remember that I am "the prime pessimist." It is coming! I don't know where or when, BUT, history says that an economy always reverts to its mean. The further that Greenspan ( & Worse, Benanke) distorts it from the mean, the further the economy must eventually fall to achieve its balance.
If you think there is no disortion in the market, consider that what I paid $54,000.00 for is now "worth" $450.000.. and I wouldn't sell it for 5 times that amount since that would be a loss in value of a considrable amount.

Consider the fact that I have already paid inTaxes more than twice what I paid for the propery and the house I had built.

We get involved with statistics that are presented as being true, but, "Figures do lie"

Values do change! You do, in the final analysis, have to determine which view reflects the reality of the situation in which you find yourself!

My only comment is. Which is honorable and true, and which is the reality of the situation.

[Lazarus]

...consider that what I paid $54,000.00 for is now "worth" $450.000...Well the next time you sniff out one of those opportunities, do let us in on it... I could stand a little inflation on these terms...

As to the media and the stock market, first of all they dont understand it (why, I dont know - its not THAT complicated) - Most people in the media aren't really that smart...

And as usual they will NOT report anything positive that MIGHT possibly reflect a positive light on Bush and his policies... Especially since in the past they did love to quote and re-quote that cute snotty phrase, "Its the economy, stupid!"

Well the economy is rebounding quite well after the very real disaster of 9/11 and they simply refuse to report anything that might make Bush look good... Of course if it takes a dip you can rest assured that the MSM will be all over it like flies on a dead possum...

I agree in theory with Etaoin that if the market is artificially pushed to one side too far, it will right itself and rebound in the opposite direction with a vengence... However, Im not so sure we are in this situation, though, in actual practice... True, the Fed has manipulated interests rates in order to drive investors back to the stock market, but I have a great deal of faith and admiration for Greenspan (although he was not my first choice to head the Fed -Im a Milton Friedman fan), but his leadership in the Federal Reserve has been well measured, conservative and consciencious...

In truth, even though Presidents and politicians love to lay claim to economic upswings, when it comes to the economy and the Stock Market, no President really has much influence... The head of the Fed is a dictator in this arena and the overall stability of our economy in the last few years (including the Clinton years) has largely been due to the diligent dedication of Greenspan - He has deftly covered a great deal of Presidential economic mistakes by making the appropriate counter moves to keep us stable...

I hope to God after he retires we get another man of his caliber... If not, we could see some severe upheaval in our economy...

[Naturalized-Texan]

I'm waiting on the liberals to explain the stock market. I'm waiting. I'm waiting. How long do I have to wait you hypocrites? Oh come on. Let's hear it. Where are you?
Lazarus is correct. The media refuse to give President Bush the credit due him for the booming economy and the greater than 50% stock market recovery from the low point of Clinton crash (from a 7,200 Dow to a more than 11,000 Dow).

Here are some more facts about the economic boom that the doom and gloomers refuse to acknowledge:

1) 6.8 million more Americans are employed today than when President Bush took office;

2) 9.3 million more Americans are employed today that at the deepest point of the Clinton Recession;

3) 2.6 million more Americans are employed today than at the end of 2004;

4) Unemployment has dropped from 5.4% at the end of 2004 to 4.9% at the end of 2005 (Note: 4.9% unemployment is within the range of full employment);

5) The current unemployment rate is lower than the average unemployment rate in the 1970s, in the 1980s, and in the 1990s;

6) Average hourly earnings for non-supervisory production workers (low-end wages) are up 3.7 percent at an annual rate during the last three months of 2005 and are expected to continue to increase throughout 2006.

I suspect that the doom and gloomers ignore those facts for the same reason that the liberal media do.

[hdmundt]

I'm waiting on the liberals to explain the stock market. I'm waiting. I'm waiting. How long do I have to wait you hypocrites? Oh come on. Let's hear it. Where are you?

You're right on the money to expect nothing from them until the inevitable cyclical downturn arrives. Then it'll be the end of the world (no matter how slight and predictable) and, of course, it'll be George Bush's fault.

We should probably be thankful for the silence. They can't figure-out the electoral college, so it's just as well they refrain from cogitatin' on the complexities of the stock market.

[Etaoin]

Well the next time you sniff out one of those opportunities, do let us in on it... I could stand a little inflation on these terms...

Wellll, there are 30 acres and 40 years that account for some of the differences. The important thing is that the house was valued at $280,000.(by the Insurance Company) only 3 years ago. The housing boom is insane, but the market is merely reacting to the FED's actions. It is a speculator's market and a lot of good folk are going to get burned!

[Naturalized-Texan]

Warlady, just remember that I am "the prime pessimist." It is coming! I don't know where or when, BUT, history says that an economy always reverts to its mean. The further that Greenspan ( & Worse, Benanke) distorts it from the mean, the further the economy must eventually fall to achieve its balance.
If you think there is no disortion in the market, consider that what I paid $54,000.00 for is now "worth" $450.000.. and I wouldn't sell it for 5 times that amount since that would be a loss in value of a considrable amount.
The law of supply and demand in action! A perfect example. I suppose that you would favor the repeal of that basic law of economics.

[Melz]

Who expected a thing from the media. The liberals I have heard from keep whining that it took so long to get to this level and it should be so much higher by now. These, I assure you, are not economists or financial analysts, they are liberals who probably are not even invested.

After the Clinton Crash ( which I do not blame on him, but what the hell, it happened on HIS WATCH..lol), it was known thru-out the investment world that this should take 4 to 5 years to recover. And it has done just that. Anything quicker could have meant trouble. There is nothing surprising at all about this, although it is a day no liberal wanted to happen until a demmie got into office.

Laz is right, not many reporter types know jack shit about the market, and even if they interviewed an expert, they wouldn't be able to articulate his explaination in a written article. I for one would have loved to read some media reporter person try to pull off an analysis of the market right about now..LOL.

[Teenager]

Lazarus is correct. The media refuse to give President Bush the credit due him for the booming economy and the greater than 50% stock market recovery from the low point of Clinton crash (from a 7,200 Dow to a more than 11,000 Dow).

Here are some more facts about the economic boom that the doom and gloomers refuse to acknowledge:

1) 6.8 million more Americans are employed today than when President Bush took office;

2) 9.3 million more Americans are employed today that at the deepest point of the Clinton Recession;

3) 2.6 million more Americans are employed today than at the end of 2004;

4) Unemployment has dropped from 5.4% at the end of 2004 to 4.9% at the end of 2005 (Note: 4.9% unemployment is within the range of full employment);

5) The current unemployment rate is lower than the average unemployment rate in the 1970s, in the 1980s, and in the 1990s;

6) Average hourly earnings for non-supervisory production workers (low-end wages) are up 3.7 percent at an annual rate during the last three months of 2005 and are expected to continue to increase throughout 2006.

I suspect that the doom and gloomers ignore those facts for the same reason that the liberal media do.

Hey! Those are cool statistics! Where can I find them?

[Etaoin]

The law of supply and demand in action! A perfect example. I suppose that you would favor the repeal of that basic law of economics.

Not really Tex. It is the FED playing games thinking they are omnipotent. Punch the button on the printing press and lower intersest rates so that those who cannot afford housing can now get loans...and shazam!, those who never saved to buy a home, can now move into one. Print more money and Shazam, a person makes more money (of less value).

Do you really believe that NIRVANA has been attained by the manipulation of the prnting press and interest rates? I concede that the rest of the world's bankers will try to avoid the inevitable disaster, but reality will strike! I don't know when it will happen, but I can suggest why it will happen and you should be able to follow it as the Eurasians and the Asians tire of supporting Greenspan's mountains of debt.

I understand that the intentions may be good, but remember the adage @ what the road to hell is paved with!

You see Tex...My greatest fear is that our republic will not survive what we are facing. I honestly think that both of us have concerns for this nation's future, but I am a sceptic that doesn't believe all the phony figures that bolster the government's positions.

I'll offer you a challenge since you tout the Gov't's figures.

I'll put any sum you agree to into a fund that I manage and you manage an equal amount. I'll bet against the dollar and the government's policies. You support them and the winner pockets the difference! To make the challenge fair, you set the amount, $1,000 up to $10,000 and at the end of a predetermined time, the winner takes both funds!

Perhaps Sonar would be willing to monitor the test since he apper=ars to side with your position more than mine!

[Warlady]

Who expected a thing from the media. The liberals I have heard from keep whining that it took so long to get to this level and it should be so much higher by now. These, I assure you, are not economists or financial analysts, they are liberals who probably are not even invested.

After the Clinton Crash ( which I do not blame on him, but what the hell, it happened on HIS WATCH..lol), it was known thru-out the investment world that this should take 4 to 5 years to recover. And it has done just that. Anything quicker could have meant trouble. There is nothing surprising at all about this, although it is a day no liberal wanted to happen until a demmie got into office.

Laz is right, not many reporter types know jack shit about the market, and even if they interviewed an expert, they wouldn't be able to articulate his explaination in a written article. I for one would have loved to read some media reporter person try to pull off an analysis of the market right about now..LOL.

I blame the Clinton recession on him. Why? Because he and the Dem controlled Congress raised taxes higher than any Pres in our history. That's the main reason he lost control of Congress in 1994..that and Hillary care. It took a Republican controlled Congress cutting our capital gains taxes to turn things around. The only reason Clinton signed it was because Dick Morris told him if he didn't he wouldn't be reelected.

[Naturalized-Texan]

Hey! Those are cool statistics! Where can I find them?
The statistics for the first 4 items can be found here (http://www.bls.gov/schedule/archives/empsit_nr.htm). Warlady and others have posted #5 several times. The statistics for #6 can be found here (http://www.nationalreview.com/nrof_comment/darda200601061222.asp).

[Naturalized-Texan]

Etaoin: You know very well that the $450,000 assessment on your property is virtually identical to the fair market value of your property and that value is due to THE basic law of economics which is the law of supply and demand.

Your nonsense about "printing press" money is patently false. During the 1st 2 years of the Bush Administration we were in a deflationary period when the money supply was so low that it was unable to keep up with the demands of a growing economy. That deflation delayed the recovery from the Clinton Recession by at least 2 years. It was only after the money supply was increased to the point that it could support the growing economy that our current economic boom began. Since inflation is now virtually nil and the boom is continuing, the money supply certainly must be in equilibrium to the demands of the growing economy. It's nothing more than simple logic.

As for your absurd challenge: The only thing that would prove is that I don't dabble in the markets. I don't live off my investments nor do I need to. However, the percentage appreciation from my long-term investments far exceeds the percentage appreciation from our personal residence. Nuff said!

[Charity]

I think President Bush is good for America. Thank you Mr. President for a job well done and God Bless you.

[Warlady]

NT you can make your points without calling Etaoin "silly". He's our oldest and most respected member and he deserves to be treated with respect.

I agree with you Charity.

[omegatrump]

Hey! Those are cool statistics! Where can I find them?

LOL, you can find them right next to the "there is no evidence" that the wide open Mexican border is a threat to National security.

U.S. Department of Labor, (says it all) Caution: data in archived news releases may have been revised in subsequent releases. LOL

[omegatrump]

Wellll, there are 30 acres and 40 years that account for some of the differences. The important thing is that the house was valued at $280,000.(by the Insurance Company) only 3 years ago. The housing boom is insane, but the market is merely reacting to the FED's actions. It is a speculator's market and a lot of good folk are going to get burned!

I agree with you Etaoin, the rise in the market has no more to do with W than the so called good times in the Clinton era had to do with his slickness. It is a preparation for profit taking and nothing more. When they can suck in the gullible by creating the image of increase, then they turn and take their profits.

You are correct! The housing boom is insane, and can not be sustained at it's present level of increase. Not without demanding a dramatic increase in wages. In my area anyhow.

[Naturalized-Texan]

NT you can make your points without calling Etaoin "silly". He's our oldest and most respected member and he deserves to be treated with respect.
I respect him even if his doom and gloom attitude is beyond the pale. Maybe "silly" is a little too strong, but the challenge he made to me was certainly absurd.

[Warlady]

I don't agree with Etaoin's doom and gloom forecast either but I respect the fact that he's entitled to believe as he wishes.

[Naturalized-Texan]

omegatrump: You really need to read DISINFORMATION: 22 Media Myths that Undermine the War on Terror by Richard Miniter. He presents 11 pages of evidence to prove that the Canadian border, not the Mexican border, is the one we need to worry about for terrorists entering the U.S. I think that you are placing far too much faith in the myths (read: lies) presented by the liberal media.

[DoctorDoom]

The border between the US and Cada is 5525 miles long, and it is largely unpatrolled. While stemming the swarm of wetbacks is high priority, Canada is an ideal entry point for terrorists.

[Naturalized-Texan]

The border between the US and Cada is 5525 miles long, and it is largely unpatrolled. While stemming the swarm of wetbacks is high priority, Canada is an ideal entry point for terrorists.
I realize that I shouldn't contribute further to this topic drift, but I must answer omegatrump's nonsense:

In his book, Richard Miniter quotes from a book by Stewart Bell, a reporter for the National Post of Canada entitled, Cold Terror: How Canada Nurtures and Exports Terrorism Around the World which meticulously documents al Qaeda's long-term presence in Canada. Canadian terrorists took part in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing as well as many other acts of terrorism around the world.

Of course, the millenium bomber, Ahmed Ressam, who was caught by an alert customs agent, Diana Dean, as he crossed the Canadian border at Port Angeles, Washington, on his way to bomb Los Angeles International Airport was a Canadian al Qaeda terrorist.

The reason that al Qaeda terrorists congregate in Canada is that Canada is very lax in its terror laws and, in many cases, Canadians look on al Qaeda terrorists as heroes.

In stark contrast, Muslims, in general, and Islamist terrorists, in particular, are not at all welcome in Mexico. According to American Customs Agents, there is not one documented case where an al Qaeda terrorist crossed the Mexican border into the U.S.

[omegatrump]

omegatrump: You really need to read DISINFORMATION: 22 Media Myths that Undermine the War on Terror by Richard Miniter. He presents 11 pages of evidence to prove that the Canadian border, not the Mexican border, is the one we need to worry about for terrorists entering the U.S. I think that you are placing far too much faith in the myths (read: lies) presented by the liberal media.

With all due respect NT, I put no trust at all in the Liberal Media, and I put almost as little trust in the Neo Con Media. What I rely on is my own personal experience and others I know who have witnessed what I am concerned about in Mexico and Latin America.

I did just got a new book from WND, that you should read. I just started to read it but so far it reinforces my very strong opinions on current events in Israel. Book Title: Eye to Eye, Facing the Consequences of DIVIDING ISRAEL. by, William Koenig Please do read it NT

[omegatrump]

The border between the US and Cada is 5525 miles long, and it is largely unpatrolled. While stemming the swarm of wetbacks is high priority, Canada is an ideal entry point for terrorists.

Without question DD, I didn't say otherwise. I know they came down from Canada. I am saying that Mexico is one of the most corrupt nations on the planet, and I know of people who have seen Arabs in Mexico buying their way through the immigration process.

I myself have met a Jordanian immigrant on the border of Mexico and Guatemala, but that was about 15 years ago. His intention then was to cross Mexico for the United States.

Before 911 I knew of two groups in Belize who have all the ear marks of being cell groups. One group was Pakistani Muslim young males plus an ex New York City Policeman (these I met just a few months before 911, the other group was a mixture of Jordan, Pakistan, Palestinian young males, all Muslim, changing frequently. No wives, no evident future, all living off of a business a family would have a hard time existing on.

Canada has a very lax immigration policy, Mexico, well there all you need is some money.

[Naturalized-Texan]

I did just got a new book from WND, that you should read. I just started to read it but so far it reinforces my very strong opinions on current events in Israel. Book Title: Eye to Eye, Facing the Consequences of DIVIDING ISRAEL. by, William Koenig Please do read it NT
I looked it up on WND and it appears to be nothing but some kooky, wild-eyed-conspiracy-theory book unworthy of my consideration. Your recommendation of that book confirmed my suspicion that you are a conspiracy theorist. I long ago rejected conspiracy theories as nothing more than that - theories having no basis in fact.

[omegatrump]

You continue to prove my assertion that you just fly off the handle without any interest in considering the facts NT.

You are very good at repeating and maintaining the talking points that you program yourself to administer. Talk about conspiracy theorist.

I would very much like to see a conspiracy develop among the Republican party, I would like to see a conspiracy to save America from the toboggan ride into Liberalism. If the Republicans would truly conspire to stand for Conservatism instead of capitulate to the conspiracy of the democrats every time they meet with the slightest opposition then we could turn this Nation around. You do know what conspire means don't you NT?

[pinqy]

U.S. Department of Labor, (says it all) Caution: data in archived news releases may have been revised in subsequent releases. LOL
Why the "LOL?" What are you trying to imply?

[Naturalized-Texan]

Originally Posted by omegatrump
U.S. Department of Labor, (says it all) Caution: data in archived news releases may have been revised in subsequent releases. LOL
And more than 95% of the time the employment figures are revised upward. For example, the Nov. 2005 employment figures were revised upward from 142.594 million to 142.611 million.

[DesertFox]

Out to lunch with economists Paul Krugman and Paul Ehrlich.

[pinqy]

And more than 95% of the time the employment figures are revised upward. For example, the Nov. 2005 employment figures were revised upward from 142.594 million to 142.611 million.
That's because some companies report late.

[Warlady]

I realize that I shouldn't contribute further to this topic drift, but I must answer omegatrump's nonsense:

In his book, Richard Miniter quotes from a book by Stewart Bell, a reporter for the National Post of Canada entitled, Cold Terror: How Canada Nurtures and Exports Terrorism Around the World which meticulously documents al Qaeda's long-term presence in Canada. Canadian terrorists took part in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing as well as many other acts of terrorism around the world.

Of course, the millenium bomber, Ahmed Ressam, who was caught by an alert customs agent, Diana Dean, as he crossed the Canadian border at Port Angeles, Washington, on his way to bomb Los Angeles International Airport was a Canadian al Qaeda terrorist.

The reason that al Qaeda terrorists congregate in Canada is that Canada is very lax in its terror laws and, in many cases, Canadians look on al Qaeda terrorists as heroes.

In stark contrast, Muslims, in general, and Islamist terrorists, in particular, are not at all welcome in Mexico. According to American Customs Agents, there is not one documented case where an al Qaeda terrorist crossed the Mexican border into the U.S.

NT writes:

In stark contrast, Muslims, in general, and Islamist terrorists, in particular, are not at all welcome in Mexico. According to American Customs Agents, there is not one documented case where an al Qaeda terrorist crossed the Mexican border into the U.S.

NT please tell me why you believe this and provide proof of your belief. I don't believe for a minute that Mexico doesn't welcome Al Qaeda as long as they pay off the officials. And, where is your proof that American customs agents make that claim? I'm not siding with omegatrump but I know Mexico and they are indeed the most corrupt neighbor we've ever had. I've had friends who have been jailed for no other reason than they didn't pay off the officials. I will never go back to Mexico. It's just not safe.<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->