FC verdict on Mark Foley

[Republican_Legion]

Regarding the new information http://passionateamerica.blogspot.com/2006/10/meet-jordan-edmund-one-mark-foley.html
That foley only IMed pages 18 and over.
What is the verdict on foley over here ?
I would say that he is a Gay Republican who got himself into trouble with a 18 yearold on IMing and he deceived his supporters of his orientation but he resigned with character which is something democrats dont do.

[Rhino]

The age makes no difference legally. Otherwise I agree with you.

[Republican_Legion]

The age makes no difference legally. Otherwise I agree with you.

Well I would add that the MSM thinks the age is the main reason they pushed the story. Revealing that the pages were adults defeats the idea that foley was a pedophile but they dont care they got their story out there and people are less likely to here the new information.

You are right though that legally the age doesnt make a difference but in the public view it does since if they see that he is a pedophile it will give the public a more then negative view of foley.

I think foley should consider saying that he only chatted with adults and that the democratic party is homophobic. This may draw fence sitting gay republicans/libertarians to vote for the GOP in 06.

Well at least foley wasnt married and had an affair with another man like that former governor of NJ.

[Rhino]

I was speaking facts. You are speaking MSM. Those two things are diametrically opposed.

[Republican_Legion]

I was speaking facts. You are speaking MSM. Those two things are diametrically opposed.

Yes but I am trying to bring into view that the media doesnt care about facts and that they pushed the story because of its content and not because of facts. I'm an enemy of the MSM and I want them to publish the facts or admit they didnt go deep enough for the whole truth. I am hoping FOX news picks up the new info from drudge etc tonight. So far foxnews is saying the same as the MSM.

[Rhino]

That's one hell of an uphill battle, but good luck.

[Republican_Legion]

I already got wikipedia to admit its a credible source. Blogs like freerepublic need to push this topic in hopes of Hannity,O'reilly,Limbaugh picking it up and commenting on it.

[d'urville]

Yes but I am trying to bring into view that the media doesnt care about facts and that they pushed the story because of its content and not because of facts. I'm an enemy of the MSM and I want them to publish the facts or admit they didnt go deep enough for the whole truth. I am hoping FOX news picks up the new info from drudge etc tonight. So far foxnews is saying the same as the MSM.

Mike Richards:

http://www.blogactive.com/2006_01_01_blogactive_archive.html
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/


Soros front group "CREW":

http://www.americanthinker.com/comments.php?comments_id=6290

MSM's trickling in....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/05/AR2006100501657.html

All allies and cohorts of the Democrat party.

[TechnoPrincess]

I think he's a pervert, but I haven't been convinced that he has actually broken any law. It appears that the subjects of his "affections" were adults when he contacted them. If it is proven otherwise, I will change my stance. Either way, I'm glad he is no longer in Congress.

[BuckeyeMike]

Just remember that old saw from a few years back:
" It doesn't have to be true.....it just has to be said!"


Once the Dems say something and their mung munchin' buddies in the MSM make it public......the damage is done.....guaranteed....every fukin' time!


I believe there was another gem put forth by one of those liberal mealy mouthed Dems......"guilty or innocent.....doesn't matter.....it's the seriousness of the charge that counts!" or something along those lines.

[Beowulf]

I voted that he's a pervert. So big deal, many of us guys are!

[Republican_Legion]

I voted that he's a pervert. So big deal, many of us guys are!

I agree his actions were that of a perverted gay man.
Will there be criminal charges ? probally since he is a republican but if he changes his voter registration maybe not. I cant see them charging him if he changed voter reg to Dem.

[Lubbock]

I think he's a pervert, but I haven't been convinced that he has actually broken any law. It appears that the subjects of his "affections" were adults when he contacted them. If it is proven otherwise, I will change my stance. Either way, I'm glad he is no longer in Congress.

I think Techno may come closest to hitting the nail on the head.

My understanding of it so far is this: there were e-mails that were "innocuous" --asking for a photograph of the Page, apparently.

When the Page complained to his parents, the parents contacted the right party in Wasington to have Foley looked at. Foley was spoken to about it and told to quit. The Page/parents didn't want the "problem" addressed any further.

The IMs seem to have been sent to former Pages, apparently past the age of being considered "children" --the FBI/Florida BI is looking into whether a crime was committed.

Here's my problem with the whole thing: I don't know how anyone could read the e-mail and not know Foley is a pervert. E-mails. Not the IMs. The e-mail screams pervert to me.

Maybe it's a man/woman, mother/father thing: maybe a man doesn't look at the e-mail and find it offensive; for most women who read it, the red flags go up.

Apparently, everyone in Congress knew Foley was queer; with that knowledge, and in light of the complaint by the Page, everyone's warning bells should have been going off.

In any case, the Dems either fabricated some of the IM's or had the actual IMs and sat on them for at least three years, waiting until this moment in time to break the story.

Here's more reporting from Clarice Feldman:

ABC Scrambling to Put Some Meat on Ross' Story
October 7th, 2006

As time passes, it is increasingly clear that the ABC News report which started the Foley firestorm is odorous—and I’m not talking Chanel.


(1) It dealt with the emails which the FBI and many media organizations considered as innocuous as the Republican leadership did. Who circulated these reports is not yet clear.Foley’s spokesman said his opponent, Mahoney had been shopping the story to the media for some time.


(2) ABC was the first to run with the story which every other media outlet, of the many which had received the email story, had passed on as unsubstantiated and not newsworthy. The only new tag for the story was that Mahoney, Foley’s opponent, called for an investigation, a demand he said was impelled by a report on a newly created, barely trafficked utterly fake website designed solely to hide the source of the emails. How did he happen to come across this website?


(3) The emails on that site, in any event, are themselves demonstrably fake (http://strata-sphere.com/blog/index.php/archives/2653).
(4) Almost simultaneously with the ABC report, C.R.E.W. placed on its blogsite a .pdf file purportedly of the same emails. It has refused to disclose to the FBI their provenance. And an ex-page, Jason Edmund, later determined to be one of the ex-pages involved in an IM exchange, posted notification of the story on the now removed (but screen saved) page website run by an another ex page, Matthew Loraditch. See post #264 here (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1714978/posts?q=1&&page=269#269/).)


There is a suggestion, I think, that he’d been anticipating this story. Did Ross, or someone acting with him or on his behalf, have contact with the ex-pages [I]before the initial story ran? Or is this another of the many curious coincidences which surround this story?


(5) Ross reports that overnight after that story ran, he received racier IMs from other ex pages. Loraditch, who ran the page website, was quoted by ABC as saying he’d seen some steamy IMs in which Foley purportedly had been involved. After considerable ducking, ABC has finally admitted that the IMs came not from the ex-pages themselves , but from “other pages (http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/199615.php)”.


http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5925


I would encourage everyone to read Feldman's reporting on this from the past few days.

[Gonzo67]

The thing you can't over-look. The page told Foley that he was only 17. And still Foley pursued it.


was when the teen in the instant message said, "im not 18 till feb 23."


This should have backed Foley down. But instead, Foley kept the sexually explicit conversations going.

Granted, it may or may not have been a lie on the part of the Page. But Foley has no way to know this. As far as he knows, this is a 17 year old kid he's being perverted with. In my opinion, that earns him the title of Pedophile. His INTENT was to arrange a sexual encounter with an under age male.

This would be the equivalent of the cops that troll the chat rooms, claiming to be 15 or 16, arrange a meeting with a would be pedophile, and arrest him on pedophilia charges. Only this time, it wasn't a cop that stung the pedo, it was a page playing a prank.

Regardless of the circumstances, it was Foley's intent to seduce an under age male.

Now, I'm not "bashing" the Republican party. And I am most certainly NOT saying the Democrats are 100% right in the matter. But, with all the finger pointing that goes on with BOTH sides, I think that the GOP should be willing to consider criminal charges, which is something they claim the Dems SHOULD but never do. The GOP could place themselves on a higher level if they handle this one by the books, and leave out all the "Democrats are using this..." etc.

[Lubbock]

Gonzo, you said " . . . I think that the GOP should be willing to consider criminal charges . . . "

Against someone other than Foley?

Other than Foley, I can't imagine who.

As to Foley, Denny Hastert called the FBI and insisted on an investigation before he told Foley to get out of Congress.

I think calling the FBI from the jump constitutes more than just being willing to consider criminal charges.

[Gonzo67]

Gonzo, you said " . . . I think that the GOP should be willing to consider criminal charges . . . "

Against someone other than Foley?


No, I am referring to charges against Foley.

As I said, I was not saying the GOP is handling this wrong, but the fact remains that Foley thought he was talking to a minor. That makes his intentions quite clear.

But too many Republicans and Conservative have used the argument "Well, the Democrats never charge one of their own with a crime, why should the Republicans?"

Thats just a long winded way of saying, "A democrat molested a child, so we should let a republican molest one".

Foley believed he was IMing a minor. He continued to do so even after being told by the other party that he was speaking to a minor. That clearly states, in my opinion, that Foley intended to participate in a sexual encounter with a minor. By definition, he's a pedophile.

And as much as everyone here is disgusted by pedophilia (myself included), I fail to see the logic in all the support Foley seems to be getting from the same people who would have condemned this man and screamed for execution if he were a Democrat instead of a Republican.

I think it's time for ALL of us here to "practice what we preach". If you think Pedophiles should be locked away for good, then how can you not think the same of Foley? Is the fact that he's a Republican actually an "excuse"?

As i said, I am well aware that this has turned out to be a prank. That the page he was chatting with might have been 18 years old. But that does not change the single fact that Foley had NO IDEA this was a prank being conducted by an 18 year old page. As far as he knew, he was attempting to get a 17 year old male page into his bed. He is a pedophile, in the eyes of the law, and in the eyes of any person that can see his actions for what they were.

Edit, Added:

Look at the pol at the top of this thread. So far, 37.5% say he's a pervert, but NOT a criminal. That tells me that most of the people that are here voting so far believe he's done NOTHING illegal. When in fact he has. He engaged in sexual misconduct (even if just typed conversation) with someone he BELIEVED to be a minor. He suggested making CONTACT with a person he believed to be a minor. His intentions toward someone he believed to be a minor is quite clear. How can you NOT call him a pedophile?

[Republican_Legion]

As i said, I am well aware that this has turned out to be a prank. That the page he was chatting with might have been 18 years old. But that does not change the single fact that Foley had NO IDEA this was a prank being conducted by an 18 year old page. As far as he knew, he was attempting to get a 17 year old male page into his bed. He is a pedophile, in the eyes of the law, and in the eyes of any person that can see his actions for what they were.

Then he is a pedophile since he was going after what he thought was a 17 yearold but the fact the kid was 18 makes it not a crime but Foley remains a sick twisted Pedophile.

[Gonzo67]

Then he is a pedophile since he was going after what he thought was a 17 year old but the fact the kid was 18 makes it not a crime but Foley remains a sick twisted Pedophile.


Then we have allot of "Non-Criminals" in prison right now.

Police routinely set up internet stings. They have ADULT police officers posing as minors in chat rooms. They talk sexually with "online predators" and after a while, agree to an "in person meeting". They use an under cover cop that looks like a minor from a distance, and when the would be pedophile shows up, they arrest him.

How can they do this if no crime was being committed? The pedophile BELIEVED the person he was chatting with to be a minor. But it was in fact an adult who was LYING. The pedophile showed up to meet a minor, but it was in fact an ADULT who was PRETENDING to be a minor who showed up to the meeting to arrest him.

And yet, he's still charged with a crime because of his INTENTIONS.

How is this any different than what Foley has done?

Foley's intentions were the EXACT SAME as that online pedophile. If one is a crime, how is the other NOT a crime?

[Gonzo67]

And the one thing that pisses me off is, I can't change my vote. I screwed up and clicked the wrong item in the poll, so my vote doesn't reflect my belief. So it's my fault, the results are a bit Inaccurate:

The choice: Hes a Gay GOPer that got into trouble over IMing with another adult who was mistaken as a minor should have 2 votes so far and be 12.5%

and

the choice: Hes a pedophile and deserves to be charged with a crime. Should have 3 votes, and be at 18.75%.

Sorry for pooching the poll results. If anyone knows how to change your vote, please let me know so I can fix it.

[Republican_Legion]

Then we have allot of "Non-Criminals" in prison right now.

Police routinely set up internet stings. They have ADULT police officers posing as minors in chat rooms. They talk sexually with "online predators" and after a while, agree to an "in person meeting". They use an under cover cop that looks like a minor from a distance, and when the would be pedophile shows up, they arrest him.

How can they do this if no crime was being committed? The pedophile BELIEVED the person he was chatting with to be a minor. But it was in fact an adult who was LYING. The pedophile showed up to meet a minor, but it was in fact an ADULT who was PRETENDING to be a minor who showed up to the meeting to arrest him.

And yet, he's still charged with a crime because of his INTENTIONS.

How is this any different than what Foley has done?

Foley's intentions were the EXACT SAME as that online pedophile. If one is a crime, how is the other NOT a crime?

Arent you the same one who said that the cops should be charged with a crime also in another thread ?. We dont know if Foley and Edmund actually met up in person after the emails and IMs so the situation isnt the same.


The pedophile showed up to meet a minor, but it was in fact an ADULT who was PRETENDING to be a minor who showed up to the meeting to arrest him.


So far to public knowledge foley hasnt done this until proven otherwise.
Take it easy on the 'CAPS' it makes it seem as though you have an anger problem.

[Republican_Legion]

And the one thing that pisses me off is, I can't change my vote. I screwed up and clicked the wrong item in the poll, so my vote doesn't reflect my belief. So it's my fault, the results are a bit Inaccurate:

The choice: Hes a Gay GOPer that got into trouble over IMing with another adult who was mistaken as a minor should have 2 votes so far and be 12.5%

and

the choice: Hes a pedophile and deserves to be charged with a crime. Should have 3 votes, and be at 18.75%.

Sorry for pooching the poll results. If anyone knows how to change your vote, please let me know so I can fix it.

I want to change mine also.

[Lubbock]

Hold the wedding!

" . . . If you think Pedophiles should be locked away for good, then how can you not think the same of Foley? . . . "

I think Foley ought to kill himself.

He should put a gun to his head and pull the trigger.

For what he did to kids, and for what he's done to Republicans, he should not live.

How's that?

[Republican_Legion]

That or the Secret Service should do it. I'd suggest the SS lock his legs in cement and throw him into the alantic ocean.

[Gonzo67]

Arent you the same one who said that the cops should be charged with a crime also in another thread ?.


I believe you are referring to the thread about the porn and the postal inspector. No, I did not say that. I sided with the police and said their actions were legitimate.


We don't know if Foley and Edmund actually met up in person after the emails and IMs so the situation isnt the same.


No, they didn't have the opportunity. And we can only guess whether he would have or would not have met with the page if the opportunity presented itself.

But the fact still remains, it was his INTENTION of pursuing a sexual relationship with an individual he believed to be a minor. He IS a pedophile.


So far to public knowledge Foley hasnt done this until proven otherwise.
Take it easy on the 'CAPS' it makes it seem as though you have an anger problem.


Quite true, again, he did not have the chance to meet the page in person. But it's clear from his messages that he intended to do so at the first opportunity. It's also clear that the person he intended to meet, as far as he knew, was a minor.

As for the caps, if I has typed the entire sentence in caps, that would indicate shouting. Capping a single word within a sentence expresses emphasis on that word.

[Gonzo67]

Hold the wedding!

" . . . If you think Pedophiles should be locked away for good, then how can you not think the same of Foley? . . . "

I think Foley ought to kill himself.


My apologies Lubbock. That comment was not intended to be directed specifically at you. Though I admit the way my post was worded it did appear to be so. I'm cooking dinner (Home Made Chicken Noodles) while I post, and I am frequently up and down from the keyboard 3 or 4 times in the course of a single post. So syntax and context sometimes suffers as a result.

That statement was made "in general". Meaning, "If ANYONE thinks pedo's should be locked away for good, then how can they NOT think the same thing of Foley?"

Again, my apologies, it was not meant to suggest you were soft on Foley, it was merely a rhetorical question directed at people in general. It was my failure to be clear that made it appear otherwise.

[Gonzo67]

That or the Secret Service should do it. I'd suggest the SS lock his legs in cement and throw him into the alantic ocean.


In most circumstances when dealing with a pedophile, I would more than agree with this. I would volunteer to pour the cement.

But in this case, I believe it should be left to the GOP to keep their house clean. The end result should be the same, but the GOP is in danger of suffering the bad publicity, they should be afforded the opportunity to make an example out of this Pedo piece of shit, and show the voting public what the Democrats are all about.

[Republican_Legion]

In most circumstances when dealing with a pedophile, I would more than agree with this. I would volunteer to pour the cement.

But in this case, I believe it should be left to the GOP to keep their house clean. The end result should be the same, but the GOP is in danger of suffering the bad publicity, they should be afforded the opportunity to make an example out of this Pedo piece of shit, and show the voting public what the Democrats are all about.

OK and when can the admins delete the poll here.
I'd like to change my vote to 'Torture him then give him the death penalty. The democrats will show their true colors if we manage to get NAMBLA to expose its ties to the DNC and barney frank etc and if the democrats scream about foleys rights be violated.

[Wyatt_Junker]

There was a time when dialgoue like this was funny. Apparently today, if it was in an IM, yer screwed.

<HR width="30%">
Captain Oveur (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0336335/): You ever been in a cockpit before?
Joey (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0365283/): No sir, I've never been up in a plane before.
Captain Oveur (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0336335/): You ever seen a grown man naked?

<HR width="30%"> Captain Oveur (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0336335/): Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?

<HR width="30%"> Captain Oveur (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0336335/): Joey, have you ever been to a Turkish prison?

[Wyatt_Junker]

Not sure if Foley propositioned the 18 year old. I know he did ask him if he was going to wear a jockstrap at the soccer game.

He may have cyber 'pooged himself.

But he didn't set up a time to 'get on it'.

[Gonzo67]

But he didn't set up a time to 'get on it'.


Not entirely accurate there bro...


Maf54 (7:46:01 PM): well I better let you go do oyur thing
Xxxxxxxxx (7:46:07 PM): oh ok
Xxxxxxxxx (7:46:11 PM): have fun campaigning
Xxxxxxxxx (7:46:17 PM): or however you spell it
Xxxxxxxxx (7:46:18 PM): lol
Xxxxxxxxx (7:46:25 PM): ill see ya in a couple of weeks


and:


Maf54: I miss you lots since san diego.
Teen: ya I cant wait til dc
Maf54: :)
Teen: did you pick a night for dinner
Maf54: not yet…but likely Friday
Teen: ok…ill plan for Friday then
Maf54: that will be fun


Seems to me that they had definite plans in the works. And there's plenty in the IM that shows that Foley believed he was talking to a minor.

Any way you slice it. Foley is a Pedophile. Whether or not THIS "would be victim" was under age or not is not the point. The point is, Foley believed he was a minor, he fully intended to meet this minor, and he had a NUMBER of "graphically explicit" conversations with a person he believed was a minor.

So should we wait until he actually FINDS a minor next time and molests him before we call him a pedophile? I for one think that's a poor idea.

He is a pedophile. Plain and simple. It's just fortunate he was exposed before he could get his hands on an actual minor and molest him.

[Wyatt_Junker]

Foley is a pervert and a dumb ass.

I'm not sure how legal works here in terms of intent. Is it necessary to have an actual date to show intent or not? Or is IMing enough in itself to make the case?

I don't know. The guy's a dipshit. The GOP should have had better control over its minions. Hell, I am forced to have biannual sexual harrassment meetings with my sups. I do, too. I get 35 adults in a room and together we talk about how not to touch, glance, gaze at or tell dirty jokes to co-workers. We've got a wonderfully sterile and safe environment now. We're legally airtight. Why can't the GOP clean up its own house before this shit goes plop into the media's shitter?

But, my point was, -besides all that- the new code is that you can't say shit around a 17 year/11 month old without threat of jail. You can't even joke with them about the movie American Pie.

A long time ago, in the 70's, even the 80's you could be a little more reckless and I liked reckless, even preferred it. I liked being able to get hurt and not run to a lawyer for help. I remember my Uncle Mike in 1979 was drunk and we were walking into a K-Mart. I was just a kid. He saw another kid riding one of those horseys that you stick a quarter into and it vibrates. My uncle turned to me and said really loud, in front of the kid's parents too, 'hey, I bet that kid really likes that, eh? *hiccup* Must feel realy good?' The parents even laughed.

Now he would have gotten his ass thrown in jail.

And that Airplane dialogue is not made up either.

Society today, is sooo much fun.

[Peachdiane]

I voted Fo the Pedo should be charged but not sure if they have enough evidence to do so....

[dPrasse]

That or the Secret Service should do it. I'd suggest the SS lock his legs in cement and throw him into the alantic ocean.

Sounds good to me ... or have the Clintons do it , Vince Foster style ...

[dPrasse]

The democrats will show their true colors if we manage to get NAMBLA to expose its ties to the DNC and barney frank etc and if the democrats scream about foleys rights be violated.

Oh , so now the GOP is the party of moral equivalence , too ?

I thought only Dems said .." well , they did it too ..."

just because the Dem party has a complete lack of moral integrity doesn't mean the GOP should also have the same lack of integrity ...

[Peachdiane]

This is for the Left's double standard

http://www.lucianne.com/routine/images/10-08-06.JPG