Fred Thompson Adviser Rips Hillary

[The_Elucidator]

<TABLE class=copy cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top colSpan=2>Fred Thompson Adviser Rips Hillary

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=article_datestamp vAlign=top align=left>Tuesday, September 11, 2007 9:29 PM</TD><TD class=article_datestamp id=article_fontsize vAlign=top align=right></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top>
An adviser to Republican presidential candidate Fred Thompson said Tuesday that Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton should have been leery of accepting $850,000 from a fugitive Asian-American this year because her husband experienced similar problems when he was president.


Rich Galen said Clinton's 2008 campaign has become "the sequel" to her husband's scandal-plagued 1996 campaign, according to the Dallas Examiner.

More Here (http://www.newsmax.com/insidecover/thompson_hillary/2007/09/11/31847.html)
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[Lubbock]

Well, Rich Galen is exactly right . . . or he would be right if he was talking about individuals other than the Grifters-In-Chief.

In the case of the Clintons, they firmly believe that they should never have to answer for anything . . . and so far, history has proven them exactly correct in that assumption.

[Lazarus]

The difference is that this scandal has hit Hilary DURING the election process - even worse, early in the campaign... Whereas Bill's scandal came to light after the election was over...

This could make the Clinton's very nervous - and when the Clintons become nervous, people die under mysterious circumstances...

[gnome]

This could make the Clinton's very nervous - and when the Clintons become nervous, people die under mysterious circumstances...

Like whom? :confused:

[The_Elucidator]

Like whom? :confused: :rotflmbo: You can't be serious...

[gnome]

:rotflmbo: You can't be serious...

I'm very serious... I'm wondering if you're bringing up a famous "list" i've seen floating around...

[Naturalized-Texan]

Start with Vince Foster and there are dozens more potential witnesses against the Clintons who conveniently died under mysterious circumstances.

[gnome]

You mean these guys?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp

[BuckeyeMike]

Ron Brown comes to mind right off the bat!

[Jester21]

The Clintons aren't killing people any more than the Bushes are. This is nonsense.

[gnome]

Ron Brown comes to mind right off the bat!

It touches on that too. I've been studying that case lately, and haven't been able to come up with a plausible assassination scenario based on the facts... do you have one to consider?

[Naturalized-Texan]

Our resident libs are deluding themselves about the Clintons' desperation to protect themselves by whatever means necessary from prosecution for their many crimes.

[gnome]

Our resident libs are deluding themselves about the Clintons' desperation to protect themselves by whatever means necessary from prosecution for their many crimes.

I have linked to a very well-researched rebuttal. I realize it is not the last word, but why not start from that and point out where it is wrong?

[DesertFox]

Thing is, gnome, that nobody but the Clintons -- nobody -- ever had so many people connected to them die under odd circumstances. Nobody else is even close. I'm near 60 years old and I haven't had anywhere near that many people even just die -- much less under strange circumstances -- that I was connected to, either professionally or personally or casually or all three. I think that's what keeps the suspicions alive.

[Jester21]

Fat people having heart attacks isn't mysterious, suicides possibly but there's never been anything linking the Clintons to these deaths. Any of them. And the snopes article gnome linked to made a good point: if Clinton can't keep an oval office blowjob quiet, how do you figure he's managed to order the murders of 34 people and stayed out of prison?

[Jack_Savage]

Fat people having heart attacks isn't mysterious, suicides possibly but there's never been anything linking the Clintons to these deaths. Any of them. And the snopes article gnome linked to made a good point: if Clinton can't keep an oval office blowjob quiet, how do you figure he's managed to order the murders of 34 people and stayed out of prison?
Do you think first-Bro Roger is above whacking someone?

There was something in the drool coming off of the smile on Clintons face when he emphatically stated how hard he tried to kill Osama that made me think, "this guy has done it before!"

Anyone else see that smirk?

[Seabee]

Fat people having heart attacks isn't mysterious, suicides possibly but there's never been anything linking the Clintons to these deaths. Any of them. And the snopes article gnome linked to made a good point: if Clinton can't keep an oval office blowjob quiet, how do you figure he's managed to order the murders of 34 people and stayed out of prison?

I do not know about the 30 or so other mysterious deaths that have shadowed the Clintons. But there is one that is more suspicious than any of the others, Vince Foster included, and that was Ron Brown. Brown was set to testify against Clinton in the Senate investigation on White Water about a week after his death. The testimony was supposed to be very damaging to the Clintons, both Hitlery and Pill. Mighty coincidental that he never got a chance to give that testimony.
Besides in today's society I think we are more concerned with investigating a freaking blowjob than a murder, I wouldnt say we have a very high value on life, we prefer soap opera drama. Sad state of affairs but that is the country and the world we live in.

[Jester21]

Brown was set to testify against Clinton in the Senate investigation on White Water about a week after his death. The testimony was supposed to be very damaging to the Clintons, both Hitlery and Pill. Mighty coincidental that he never got a chance to give that testimony.

It was coincidental. From gnome's link, Brown died in a plane crash along with 30 other people, in Croatia. The crash was largely blamed due to crew error, presumably the crew that numbered among the 30 some-odd dead. So in order for the conspiracy theory to work, it would mean that the crew was out to get Brown for reasons known only to them and Clinton, and in that their eagerness to off Brown, they accidentally killed themselves.

[gnome]

Thing is, gnome, that nobody but the Clintons -- nobody -- ever had so many people connected to them die under odd circumstances. Nobody else is even close. I'm near 60 years old and I haven't had anywhere near that many people even just die -- much less under strange circumstances -- that I was connected to, either professionally or personally or casually or all three. I think that's what keeps the suspicions alive.

The point of the article, if you read it, is that many of these people had tenuous or NO significant connection to the Clintons... and that the circumstances were often not as strange as the alarmist article would have you believe. Have you actually read it yet?

[gnome]

I do not know about the 30 or so other mysterious deaths that have shadowed the Clintons. But there is one that is more suspicious than any of the others, Vince Foster included, and that was Ron Brown. Brown was set to testify against Clinton in the Senate investigation on White Water about a week after his death. The testimony was supposed to be very damaging to the Clintons, both Hitlery and Pill. Mighty coincidental that he never got a chance to give that testimony.
Besides in today's society I think we are more concerned with investigating a freaking blowjob than a murder, I wouldnt say we have a very high value on life, we prefer soap opera drama. Sad state of affairs but that is the country and the world we live in.

The Ron Brown case is the one I've come to know the most about. Frankly I think that's one of the worst candidates for imagining a conspiracy to assassinate. Based on what you know, can you describe a plausible scenario?


Bear in mind... where I cut my teeth on these theories, we spend as much time defending Bush from stupid accusations that he masterminded 9-11.

[TheIrishman]

I read that one examining physician listed a gunshot to the back of Ron Brown's head.
Coupla Arkansas cops died suddenly.
McDougald[right name?] said he would testify one day, he was dead during the night. [The man in prison]. The wife wouldn't even talk after that!

[The_Elucidator]

The Clintons aren't killing people any more than the Bushes are. This is nonsense.

Dude, save it! :rolleyes:

[DoctorDoom]

Vince Foster was sufficient. His link to the Arkanmafiosi was well established. Allegedly, he committed suicide, but only a consummate liar or an utter imbecile would make that judgment.

BTW, your idol made very clear how he thinks.


http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/1996/cyb19961111.asp

4) Reminding one of Nixonian thinking, last week Bill Clinton promised to "cut out of American politics" his enemies. The comment has hardly generated any media outrage. I've only seen it on one TV show: CNN's Late Edition, and then only thanks to Bill Bennett. On Sunday, November 10 host Frank Sesno raised it during an interview with Bennett and Mario Cuomo:

Frank Sesno to Mario Cuomo: "Mario Cuomo I need to ask you about this, because amid all this hugging and this 'vital center' and this other nonsense that we hear about that will soon fade away as we actually get down to the reality, there is this item that Bill Bennett actually caught in USA Today a couple of days back that's a pick up from the Associated Press quoting Bill Clinton as telling political supporters in Arkansas that he 'will devote a lot of time,' I am quoting from the paper here, 'going after detractors who pursued him on Whitewater and other ethical questions.' He called political attackers, quote, 'a cancer,' and vowed, quote 'to cut them out of American politics.'"

Cuomo: "Excuse me, that was President Clinton?"

Sesno: "Yes. That is remarkable stuff. What do you make of that?"

As Bennett observed, if the President were Republican such a remark would cause "a firestorm" in the media.

[gnome]

I read that one examining physician listed a gunshot to the back of Ron Brown's head.
Coupla Arkansas cops died suddenly.
McDougald[right name?] said he would testify one day, he was dead during the night. [The man in prison]. The wife wouldn't even talk after that!

First of all, some sources would be nice...

Secondly, consider the "gunshot" possibility. If the plan was to assassinate Brown in a plane, why leave a gunshot wound that could be found by examining physicians? There are very few scenes investigated more than plane crashes. Surely there are less stupid ways to assassinate someone.

[Naturalized-Texan]

I do not know about the 30 or so other mysterious deaths that have shadowed the Clintons. But there is one that is more suspicious than any of the others, Vince Foster included, and that was Ron Brown. Brown was set to testify against Clinton in the Senate investigation on White Water about a week after his death. The testimony was supposed to be very damaging to the Clintons, both Hitlery and Pill. Mighty coincidental that he never got a chance to give that testimony.
Also, Vince Foster was an honorable man whose conscience was plaguing him about all the Clinton crimes in which he was involved. He was about to give a sworn statement to prosecutors regarding Whitewater a day or two after he turned up dead in Ft. Marcy Park. Whether he committed suicide or was murdered has not yet been satisfactorily determined. However, there is no way that he died in Ft. Marcy Park because there was no evidence there of a shooting - no bullet, no shell, no blood, etc. - and the gun was even planted in the right hand (Foster was left-handed). His body had to have been moved there after he was dead. Where did he die? He was likely either murdered or committed suicide in his White House office and then his body was removed to the park.

[Naturalized-Texan]

And there were the women BJ Clinton raped.

The rape of Juanita Broaddrick (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44451)

In addition to Juanita Broaddrick's sworn testimony, at least 3 other women independently provided sworn testimony to the Independent Prosecutor about being raped by BJ Clinton.

[hdmundt]

The Ron Brown case is the one I've come to know the most about. Frankly I think that's one of the worst candidates for imagining a conspiracy to assassinate. Based on what you know, can you describe a plausible scenario?

I'm not necessarily a promoter of the theory, but Clinton could easily have dictated to Zhang's people that they take care of Brown or they could get their technology info elsewhere. Not only is that a plausible scenario - given the backdrop and Clinton's personality, it's damned likely. And don't completely discount the murder-on-a-plane scenario. It has certain advantages for the properly motivated killer.

[gnome]

And there were the women BJ Clinton raped.

The rape of Juanita Broaddrick (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44451)

In addition to Juanita Broaddrick's sworn testimony, at least 3 other women independently provided sworn testimony to the Independent Prosecutor about being raped by BJ Clinton.

I don't intend here to defend him against every accusation--I'm not sufficiently researched to address it. I just particularly bristle at the murder accusations because so many of them are completely spurious.

[gnome]

I'm not necessarily a promoter of the theory, but Clinton could easily have dictated to Zhang's people that they take care of Brown or they could get their technology info elsewhere. Not only is that a plausible scenario - given the backdrop and Clinton's personality, it's damned likely. And don't completely discount the murder-on-a-plane scenario. It has certain advantages for the properly motivated killer.

Well, talk to me about it... how would the plan go, given the facts we have?

[Venus de Smilo]

Fat people having heart attacks isn't mysterious, suicides possibly but there's never been anything linking the Clintons to these deaths. Any of them. And the snopes article gnome linked to made a good point: if Clinton can't keep an oval office blowjob quiet, how do you figure he's managed to order the murders of 34 people and stayed out of prison?

Most of the victims were centered around Clinton activities in Arkansas, for one thing. They ruled the roost there and had full use of the Dixie mafia and the media was afraid to touch them. They still are. The DC deaths are far, far fewer and the coverups effected by the DC operatives, as opposed to the unfettered Dixie mafia, were much more adroitly effected.

I don't know if there are fully 34 dead or not, but logic and objective analysis of the known facts lead to no other logical conclusion than that the Clintons have a systematic pattern of offing their enemies.

The comparison to Monicagate is specious because both Bubba and Monica were too squarely in the spotlight for the Clinton operatives to off Monica. The political ramifications of her dying under suspicious circumstances would have been horrendous. The Clintons would have presented the media with circumstances they could not avoid investigating and reporting on because of public outcry which would have opened the floodgate to look at all the other suspicious deaths surrounding the Clintons. There was never such risk in the Arkansas-based cases.

Snopes is a notoriously left-spun site. They have no credibility anymore. They may be accurate about their non-political and non-politically correct subject matter articles, but when it comes to political matters, they shill for the 'rats just like the rest of the media does.

[Venus de Smilo]

Also, Vince Foster was an honorable man whose conscience was plaguing him about all the Clinton crimes in which he was involved. He was about to give a sworn statement to prosecutors regarding Whitewater a day or two after he turned up dead in Ft. Marcy Park. Whether he committed suicide or was murdered has not yet been satisfactorily determined. However, there is no way that he died in Ft. Marcy Park because there was no evidence there of a shooting - no bullet, no shell, no blood, etc. - and the gun was even planted in the right hand (Foster was left-handed). His body had to have been moved there after he was dead. Where did he die? He was likely either murdered or committed suicide in his White House office and then his body was removed to the park.

Foster knew where the Whitewater skeletons dwelled.

The Clintons had their operatives off him.

[Rhino]

I also have it on good authority that Hillary shot JR.

[The_Elucidator]

I also have it on good authority that Hillary shot JR.


Bitch!! :flame:

[gnome]

Snopes is a notoriously left-spun site. They have no credibility anymore. They may be accurate about their non-political and non-politically correct subject matter articles, but when it comes to political matters, they shill for the 'rats just like the rest of the media does.

Where they editorialize you may draw such a conclusion... but if you're questioning their facts, shouldn't you point out which facts they got wrong?

[Rhino]

What difference does it make? They're liberals, so their 30 second statute of limitations ran out long ago. Now, if they were conservatives, we could claim reparations from their descendents 400 years from now.

[Naturalized-Texan]

Foster knew where the Whitewater skeletons dwelled.

The Clintons had their operatives off him.
That is the most likely explanation.

You're also right about the Dixie mafia (aka, the Arkansas Mafia) protecting the Clintons by arranging for the convenient mysterious deaths of potential witnesses against them.

Probably the most heinous "mysterious deaths" were the 2 teenage boys who had witnessed the Clinton-controlled drug operation through the Mena airport. They were drugged and placed on nearby railroad tracks to be run over by a train. The Clintons managed to get Arkansas authorities to declare their deaths as "accidental." I have often wondered how many millions of dollars of drug money the Clintons have deposited in Swiss bank accounts.

[gnome]

Which facts did snopes get wrong about the two teenage boys?

[Lubbock]

For years and years and years I believed that a really evil cabal was behind the Clintons. Someone extremely evil was pulling the strings. Someone with purely evil intentions for America.

In light of where we were before anyone outside of Arkansas ever heard of Bill Clinton, and in comparison of where we are today with the Moveon.orgs of the world, my belief has not been shaken.

When you stand off at a distance and look at it in its totality, there is no other explanation for how a Fat Horndog Redneck of questionable parentage --no known father and a bar fly for a mother, came to be the President of the United States.

Hillary.

She's the Manchurian Candidate.

She's the one whose strings have been pulled by the Evil Cabal.

[dPrasse]

Hillary.

She's the Manchurian Candidate.

She's the one whose strings have been pulled by the Evil Cabal.

I agree 100 % with your Evil Cabal ... she's not smart enough to pull this kinda stuff off ... she is just a nobody that feels "important" being the puppet ... if she looks as though she isn't "The One" ... The Masters will cut her strings and she'll fall into obscurity ...

[Lubbock]

Bill is just in it for the sex.

[Jester21]

I'll second gnome's question: anyone care to point out where snopes got their facts wrong? Because this is all nuts. This is like saying that Bush was behind 9/11.

[The_Elucidator]

Bill is just in it for the sex.He sure ain't in Hillary?

[Timberwolf]

Ya mean THE CLINTON BODY COUNT?? (http://www.zpub.com/un/un-bc-body.html)

Ron Brown's plane supposedly crashed into the side of a mountain during "inclement weather"....on a clear day with not so much as a cloud in the sky.

btw - there's a link to the 2 boys' deaths in the above link...

[Riverboat]

It was coincidental. From gnome's link, Brown died in a plane crash along with 30 other people, in Croatia. The crash was largely blamed due to crew error, presumably the crew that numbered among the 30 some-odd dead. So in order for the conspiracy theory to work, it would mean that the crew was out to get Brown for reasons known only to them and Clinton, and in that their eagerness to off Brown, they accidentally killed themselves.You may be right.

On the other hand, I wouldn't rule out the possibility that the plane was tampered with before takeoff. Hey, if you're a professional hit man, what's a little collateral damage when the main target is taken care of?

[Naturalized-Texan]

Ya mean THE CLINTON BODY COUNT?? (http://www.zpub.com/un/un-bc-body.html)

Ron Brown's plane supposedly crashed into the side of a mountain during "inclement weather"....on a clear day with not so much as a cloud in the sky.

btw - there's a link to the 2 boys' deaths in the above link...
The link to the train deaths doesn't work.

[Rhino]

idmedia is now idfiles. This is the new link.

http://www.idfiles.com/ojvid.htm

[Jack_Savage]

The fact that there is a serious question about the kind of slop the Clintons do ought to be a flashing neon sign to everyone saying "AVOID!".

[Kathy30]

I read "the list" and "the rebuttal". The ordinary person in the space of those 8 years has how many people who know details of their lives die like these deceased acquaintences have?

[Jack_Savage]

I read "the list" and "the rebuttal". The ordinary person in the space of those 8 years has how many people who know details of their lives die like these deceased acquaintences have?
Bingo!

[Seabee]

It was coincidental. From gnome's link, Brown died in a plane crash along with 30 other people, in Croatia. The crash was largely blamed due to crew error, presumably the crew that numbered among the 30 some-odd dead. So in order for the conspiracy theory to work, it would mean that the crew was out to get Brown for reasons known only to them and Clinton, and in that their eagerness to off Brown, they accidentally killed themselves.

That is awful big assumption, saying it was crew error. No one knows for sure. Also, I didn't say that Brown was killed by the Clinton admin. I said it was mysterious and suspicious. I do not know and frankly neither do you. All of this is speculation at the end of the day.

[gnome]

Ya mean THE CLINTON BODY COUNT?? (http://www.zpub.com/un/un-bc-body.html)

Ron Brown's plane supposedly crashed into the side of a mountain during "inclement weather"....on a clear day with not so much as a cloud in the sky.

I believe that is simply untrue. Where are you getting that information?

btw - there's a link to the 2 boys' deaths in the above link...And still nobody has answered snopes' rebuttal of that situation--which brings into question whether they had anything to do with Clinton at all. Some more are on that list because of these two--so that question is critical.

It's not a pattern of people close to Clinton dying, if these aren't close to Clinton. At least, a bunch of them aren't.

[gnome]

That is awful big assumption, saying it was crew error. No one knows for sure. Also, I didn't say that Brown was killed by the Clinton admin. I said it was mysterious and suspicious. I do not know and frankly neither do you. All of this is speculation at the end of the day.

Funny, calling the findings of an investigation an "assumption".

[gnome]

The fact that there is a serious question about the kind of slop the Clintons do ought to be a flashing neon sign to everyone saying "AVOID!".

So because everyone here is convinced that the Clintons would kill, the facts don't matter?

[DesertFox]

Yeah, facts matter. Problem is that the Clintons have a way of rearranging facts so that they are no longer true. Remember when the girl had sex with Billy Jeff but he didn't have it with her? Remember about the meaning of "is"? Remember Hillary's "luck" at turning a thousand bucks into a hundred grand? Remember how nobody could find those FBI files and then they suddenly appeared out of nowhere? Those are just off the toppa me head, and that sorta thing has a way of always being the case around a Clinton.

THAT is why people are suspicious of everything about them. And should be.

[Naturalized-Texan]

As Venus pointed out, snopes.com is run by known lefties and is only credible on non-political items. When politics are involved, snopes.com has no more credibility than the Clintons or MoveOn.org.

[Jack_Savage]

That is awful big assumption, saying it was crew error. No one knows for sure. Also, I didn't say that Brown was killed by the Clinton admin. I said it was mysterious and suspicious. I do not know and frankly neither do you. All of this is speculation at the end of the day.
I wouldn't put it past them to kill anyone. First-Bro Roger probably would offer to do it. Rogers the one who slugged that innocent guy at the baseball game right after Bill took office. A real hot-head. Blood boiling when he doesn't get his way. Furious! No. there are a whole bunch of unanswered questions on lots of subjects.

[Jester21]

That is awful big assumption, saying it was crew error.
It's what the Air Force concluded.

From a link in the snopes article, to the Air Force News:

The accident investigation board was headed by Maj. Gen. Charles H. Coolidge Jr (http://web.archive.org/web/20021002034252/http://www.af.mil/news/biographies/coolidge_ch.html)., commander of the 22nd Air Refueling Wing, McConnell Air Force Base, Kan., and representatives of the National Transportation Safety Board (http://web.archive.org/web/20021002034252/http://www.lcp.com/The-Legal-List/Federal/2.1.3.37.html) and the Federal Aviation Administration (http://web.archive.org/web/20021002034252/http://www.faa.gov/). The board president found that this accident was caused by a failure of command, aircrew error, and an improperly designed instrument approach procedure.

[Timberwolf]

My apologies, I was trying to remember info from 10 years ago...here's a more accurate depiction...

What Really Happened... (http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/CRASH/BROWN/brown.html)

On one thing all the news stories did agree. The claim was put forward repeatedly that the plane crashed in, "The worst storm in a decade". This was the exact wording used by TIME, Newsweek, and the White House in describing the accident.

However, the Dubrovnik airport weather office told a different story. The official weather report issued at the time of the crash reported light scattered rain, broken clouds at 400 feet, a thin overcast at 2000 feet, and a steady head wind right down the runway just the way pilots like it. The reported visibility was 5 miles. He flight crew acknowledged receiving this weather report (more about that later). The distance from the airport to where the aircraft crashed was less than two miles.

Storms, or to be more precise, the weather systems that produce storms, are easily recognized features. The updrafts that create a hazard for flying will push a column of clouds up to 20,000 feet for a regular storm, and up to 33,000 feet whereupon a "super cycle" sets in and a major storm, complete with lightening, is underway.

It's safe to say that had such a behemoth weather system been just two miles away from an airport reporting five mile visibility, it would have been seen. No other pilots reported such storms, and no such storm cell formations show up on weather satellite photos of the area bracketing the time of the crash.

More from the same link...

As a result of these initial stories, rescue forces sent out by French and Croatian forces in the area all headed to the wrong spot.As a result, it was several hours before any known parties arrived at the actual crash site.

When the rescuers arrived, they found one survivor, an Air Force Sergeant named Shelly Kelly, (http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/CRASH/BROWN/kelly.html) one of two stewardesses assigned to the T-43 (a modified Boeing 737) which had only recently been converted from a navigation training aircraft equipped with all the latest navigation aids to a VIP passenger transport. The rescuers spotted Shelly Kelly moving about the wreckage, several hours after the crash itself. Shelly was placed on a helicopter and evacuated to the hospital, but strangely, was dead on arrival of a broken neck! I strongly suggest that you ask your own doctor just how likely is it that someone who survives a crash by several hours and is seen moving around will suddenly develop a broken neck during a helicopter ride.

Ron Brown, along with the other crash victims, was removed from the hillside and eventually examined by Air Force Col. William Gormley, who declared Brown dead of the crash trauma itself, and ignored the hole seen in Brown's skull which was observed and commented upon by Air Force Lt. Col. Steve Cogswell and Army Lt. Col. David Hause, both of the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology.

Despite clear signs that the hole might have been the result of a gunshot, which would prompt an autopsy, no autopsy was performed. Photos and X-rays were taken, but later, as has been the case in so many other of the deaths surrounding this administration, the X-rays and photos had vanished.

[Seabee]

Funny, calling the findings of an investigation an "assumption".

Funny assuming that the government wouldn't cover something like this up and just take the investigation at face value. Not that black helos fly over my house or I am wearing my tin foil hat.

[Seabee]

It's what the Air Force concluded.

From a link in the snopes article, to the Air Force news:

Again and you think a coverup is totally improbable? Gimme a break. As I stated it is still mysterious and suspicious. Especially with that his testimony was supposed to be damaging to the Clinton's. Also Bill Clinton is a proven liar and his administration backed him up on it. I do not put anything past the Clinton's and all I am saying is something is not right about what happened.

[hdmundt]

Well, talk to me about it... how would the plan go, given the facts we have?

We'll never know the nature of the minutae of the plan. You can make up your own plan. You asked for a plausible scenario and I gave you one. I believe the flight was a private flight - one supposedly full of political hacks all of a mind, (i.e., not a commercial flight where everyone would necessarily be screened, searched, etc.), making an inside job that much easier. The killer, if there was one, would have the ultimate in captive targets. Not to belittle the authorities who did the crash investigation, but did it really get the kind of scrutiny that a crash-site in the USA gets? Even if the answer turned-out to be, "yes", could a plotter be forgiven for assuming the answer to that question would be, "no"?

Killing a planeload of people, for whatever reason, is demonstrably do-able; remember 9/11? You seem to be having trouble believing that Bill Clinton, in particular, would be capable of being a part of something like that. My contention is that someone who has the hubris (in Clinton's case, the narcissism) of a successful, American politician and the pathology of a violent, serial rapist, is more than capable of engaging in murder by proxy.... especially when those personality traits get supersized by finding themselves in the person of a President Of The United States, arguably the most powerful person in the world.

[Jester21]

Again and you think a coverup is totally improbable?
Totally improbable? No. Very, very, very, very unlikely? Yes.

all I am saying is something is not right about what happened.<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->
Well, it was a plane crash. That's not right; planes usually land safely.


The claim was put forward repeatedly that the plane crashed in, "The worst storm in a decade". This was the exact wording used by TIME, Newsweek, and the White House in describing the accident.
So the media got something wrong. Color me surprised.

rescue forces sent out by French and Croatian forces in the area
(snip)

The rescuers spotted Shelly Kelly moving about the wreckage, several hours after the crash itself. Shelly was placed on a helicopter and evacuated to the hospital, but strangely, was dead on arrival of a broken neck!

Obvious question: who broke her neck then? The rescuers? From this am I to assume that the French and Croatian governments were in on the assassination, and that word had come down from on high to the rescuers that they were to begin to rescue her, but to kill her on the trip to the hospital? All ordered by the US President, that resulted in the assassins to die along with the target in a plane crash that wasn't really a crash because even though the investigation showed it was an accident, that evidence was forged as part of a coverup to hide the truth? Really?

Ron Brown, along with the other crash victims, was removed from the hillside and eventually examined by Air Force Col. William Gormley, who declared Brown dead of the crash trauma itself, and ignored the hole seen in Brown's skull
See, this is what nobody's been able to explain: presumably, the plane was sabotaged and crashed because it was used to cover up the fact that Brown had been shot in the head. But if you're going to cause a plane crash, why not let the crash do the job? Why bother shooting him at all? How many people survive plane crashes? Answer: very few. And also disregard the fact that no trace of a bullet was found in his skull, and there was no exit wound.

[Timberwolf]

Google, "Ron Brown's murder"...the very first link is the one to which I refer:

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/CRASH/BROWN/brown.html

Scroll down to the bottom and you'll see a list of everyone who died in that crash.

Funny thing is, I don't remember ANY news coverage of it at all and there were some VERY high powered businessmen on that flight. I googled Paul Cushman (from the Riggs Bank) and what I read made my skin crawl...then again, it did read like yer run-of-the-mill conspiracy sites...oh well....

[Seabee]

Aaah, fun to debate and speculate on. But as I have posted before, no one really knows. I am sure the debate will rage on for a long time to come.

[gnome]

As Venus pointed out, snopes.com is run by known lefties and is only credible on non-political items. When politics are involved, snopes.com has no more credibility than the Clintons or MoveOn.org.

If you believe their political bias has caused them to post inaccurate facts, kindly point out the inaccuracies in their article.

If you want to say they draw bad conclusions, fine. But if you question their facts you ought to at least say which ones.

[DoctorDoom]

In 1999, a lady named Gretchen Glass wrote a long, detailed, deeply researched 5-part series called Presidential Treason 1-5. It's attached as a ZIP file that contains three DOC files. Let the Clinton apologists read it and then see if they're still eager to excuse that son of a bitch.

[Naturalized-Texan]

If you believe their political bias has caused them to post inaccurate facts, kindly point out the inaccuracies in their article.

If you want to say they draw bad conclusions, fine. But if you question their facts you ought to at least say which ones.
The "facts" that they posted more than likely are the based on the cover-up by Arkansas investigators who are beholden to Gov. Clinton for their jobs and/or fear for their lives.

[Naturalized-Texan]

It's incomprehensible that our liberal friends, the jester and gnome, actually believe that the convenient, mysterious deaths of so many people whose testimony could have put the Clintons in prison for a long, long time are all coincidental. As Rush has been saying for 15 years, nothing is coincidental with the Clintons. Not even Norman Hsu's "attempted suicide" was coincidental.

[Lubbock]

I am the very last person in the universe to believe in conspiracy theories . . . until the Clinton's names are mentioned.

When it comes the the Grifter In Chief and his Harridan Wife, anything is possible.

There is even a good possibility that I will go to my grave believing that Oklahoma City was tied to al Qaeda and Clinton played a huge part in covering it up.

[Jack_Savage]

It's incomprehensible that our liberal friends, the jester and gnome, actually believe that the convenient, mysterious deaths of so many people whose testimony could have put the Clintons in prison for a long, long time are all coincidental. As Rush has been saying for 15 years, nothing is coincidental with the Clintons. Not even Norman Hsu's "attempted suicide" was coincidental.
I didn't know that about Hsu's attempted suicide. Very good point. There are no coincidences. Ever.

[Timberwolf]

Doc, from your Zip file:Appoint Bill Richardson, Secretary of Energy, from New Mexico – home of the Los Alamos Lab. Mr. Richardson stated on the Chris Mathews' program that China was not a Communist country, that China is our friend, that China could be trusted to control a port in Southern California and that China could be trusted with its presence in Panama where it could control both ends of the canal.
And people wonder why this scumbag scares me.

Read half of Treason 101-103 and glanced through the 104 and 105...What we've been told about Sandy Berger to date pales in comparison as to what is in these documents about him...these are worth the time it'll take to read them.

GREAT find, Doc!! Thanks for posting them. :thumb:

[DoctorDoom]

The lady posted on the ReaderRant board when I was there. That's when she made them available. I have them saved in several places.

[Jack_Savage]

In 1999, a lady named Gretchen Glass wrote a long, detailed, deeply researched 5-part series called Presidential Treason 1-5. It's attached as a ZIP file that contains three DOC files. Let the Clinton apologists read it and then see if they're still eager to excuse that son of a bitch.
Berger and Podesta, look at their smile and ask yourself if you really believe in coincidences. Ask yourself what they are not capable of. Ask yourself what they and First-Bro Roger yuck it up about. Who of us laughs with them? That is our advantage.

The one thing about America is that we all can give ourselves permission to take it back from them, any time we want. Find the street fighters who will not cower to them. If this whole thing falls down. Get out the baseball bats, H&K's, Scarabs and Terzuola's, and take it back block by block.

[gnome]

The "facts" that they posted more than likely are the based on the cover-up by Arkansas investigators who are beholden to Gov. Clinton for their jobs and/or fear for their lives.

Fine, which ones, and how do you know besides that you simply don't trust them? Not that you should trust, but lack of trust doesn't eliminate the need for researched facts.

[gnome]

It's incomprehensible that our liberal friends, the jester and gnome, actually believe that the convenient, mysterious deaths of so many people whose testimony could have put the Clintons in prison for a long, long time are all coincidental. As Rush has been saying for 15 years, nothing is coincidental with the Clintons. Not even Norman Hsu's "attempted suicide" was coincidental.

My point is that many of them were not mysterious, and there are doubts as to whether many of them had anything on the Clintons or had anything to do with them at all. The quantity of spurious information doesn't improve its quality.

If I made a list of inaccurate "suspicious" deaths surrounding another politician, does the length of the list lend it any accuracy? it does not. Only the facts.

[Naturalized-Texan]

Yes, the facts as we presented them surely speak for themselves. The Clintons and their Arkansas Mafia made sure that no one would testify against them either by eliminating them or scaring them.

[gnome]

So, let's say there was another politician... if lots of people connected to him, that had potential to politically harm him, had died, that would be suspicious too?

[Timberwolf]

To whom do you refer???

[DoctorDoom]

So, let's say there was another politician... if lots of people connected to him, that had potential to politically harm him, had died, that would be suspicious too?You're farking-A right it would. So name the hypothetical politician and provide evidence for a body count comparable to the Arkanmafia's.

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

If I made a list of inaccurate "suspicious" deaths surrounding another politician, ...

Do it. Let's compare it to that of the Clintons. I HIGHLY doubt you will find as many with such connections as has been documented regarding the Arkansas Don and Dam.

[dPrasse]

You're farking-A right it would. So name the hypothetical politician and provide evidence for a body count comparable to the Arkanmafia's.

This could be fun ...

:munch:

[Jester21]

Well, a search for 'Bush Body Count' on google turns this up:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/bush_body_count.htm

It mixes up Sr and Jr, but among other tidbits:

-Orlando Letelier: He was torn to bits by a car bomb on the streets of Washington DC just before he was to testify about the Chilean dictator Pinochet. After the bombing, CIA Director George H. W. Bush told the FBI that there had been no Chilean involvement whatsoever. In 1991 the post-Pinochet Chilean Supreme Court asked George H. W. Bush if he would submit to questioning. He refused.

-Amiram Nir: He was a former Israeli agent who was in Jerusalem with George Bush during Iran Contra. He went under the assumed name of Pat Weber. Nir was scheduled to testify to the Senate subcommittee and it was feared he would reveal the truth. He perished, following the shooting-down of his aircraft with missiles from the helicopter of a man called Gene Tatum, 25-year CIA deep cover agent.

-Senator John Tower: He was appointed by the Reagan/Bush Administration to chair the bipartisan committee to investigate the Iran/Contra scandals. He directed the Tower Report and had all the Iran Contra documents and knew the inside of the story. He was killed in an uninvestigated airplane crash later in Georgia in 1991. Also killed was his daughter, Marian.

-Malcolm Baldridge: Commerce Secretary May 1987. Baldridge was familiar with the Bush family ties to the Communist Chinese. He died in a mysterious horseback riding accident.

And my personal favorite:

-President John Fitzgerald Kennedy: An internal FBI memo reported that on November 22 a reputable businessman named George H. W. Bush reported hearsay that a certain Young Republican had been talking of killing the president when he came to Houston. The Young Republican was nowhere near Dallas on that date. According to a 1988 story in The Nation, J. Edgar Hoover said in a memo that Mr. George Bush of the CIA had been briefed on November 23rd, 1963 about the reaction of anti-Castro Cuban exiles in Miami to the assassination of President Kennedy. George H. W. Bush has denied this, although he was in Texas at the time and cannot account for his whereabouts at the time.

There's about 20 names on the list.

Just to be clear, I don't believe any of this crap. Except maybe JFK, that would make a lot of sense. But it does show that Presidents tend to know a LOT of people, and sometimes, those people die.

[Naturalized-Texan]

There are some serious problems with the jester's "body count."

1) There was NO CIA involvement in deposing Allende and installing Pinochet. Allende shot himself before the Chilean freedom fighters could capture him because he knew that he would be tortured unmercifully in the same manner that he tortured so many of his political prisoners.

2) There were no laws against anything that was done related to Iran-Contra. So no cover-ups were necessary.

3) And by far the most ridiculous is the claim that "Mr. George Bush of the CIA had been briefed on November 23rd, 1963." George Bush was only associated with the CIA when he was Director from 1976 to 1977 under President Ford.

[Rhino]

It wasn't Jester's count. It was the site he linked, which he said he did not believe.

[Jester21]

There are some serious problems with the jester's "body count."

Yes, I know. The same problems as with Clinton's body count. You've got someone who knows a lot of people, and when those people die it's easy to make it seem suspicious.

There was NO CIA involvement
....that you know of. Of course, the pertinent files have been classified 'Top Secret', and won't be released for decades, if ever. Dom-Dom-DOMMMMMM

:P

[Naturalized-Texan]

It wasn't Jester's count. It was the site he linked, which he said he did not believe.
Yep! I already knew that.

However, there is more than ample evidence that many of those who had the dirt on the Clintons conveniently died under mysterious circumstances just as they were about to spill that dirt.

[Lazarus]

Tex is right about that... It is pretty evident that it is far more dangerous to be a Clinton associate than to be their opponent...

A year back someone posted a list of all the Clinton associates (and some who were not, but were in the wrong place at the wrong time) who died under mysterious circumstances... Is that list still here somewhere?

[Jester21]

You can get the names off of the snopes list.

[Naturalized-Texan]

Tex is right about that... It is pretty evident that it is far more dangerous to be a Clinton associate than to be their opponent...

A year back someone posted a list of all the Clinton associates (and some who were not, but were in the wrong place at the wrong time) who died under mysterious circumstances... Is that list still here somewhere?
TW posted it earlier:

Clinton Body Count (http://www.zpub.com/un/un-bc-body.html)

[gnome]

This was the hypothetical list I found

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a71851b1dc4.htm

Don't get me wrong, I think this list is a crock too.

My point is that the sheer volume of accusation does not amount to evidence of any of it being true, or even relevant. Each accusation has to rise and fall on its own merits.

Something else I uncovered about the Mena Airport bit in the original Clinton list... does anyone here know when, supposedly, Mena Airport began being involved in CIA drug deals? A lot earlier than Clinton. So the whole Mena Airport business is a slam on three presidents, with Clinton the last. I don't think most of you believe that Reagan and Bush Sr. were running drugs, but the people that brought you the "Clinton Body Count" do.

[Rhino]

It's in Arkansas. That's all the connection some people need.

[Naturalized-Texan]

It's in Arkansas. That's all the connection some people need.
In 1993-94 I wrote a monthly column for a small magazine published in Arkansas entitled The Slick Willy Gazette. The young couple who published and edited the magazine had documented many of the Clinton crimes as well as the cover-ups, including the convenient mysterious deaths. My wife's cousin who lived in Arkansas told us about some of same information. Apparently, it was common knowledge in Arkansas, but most people were afraid to speak out publicly.

BTW, The Slick Willy Gazette was shut down after many outlets, including most truck stops in Arkansas, who had agreed to sell the magazine, suddenly, and with no explanation, canceled their orders. That young couple strongly suspected that Clinton's Arkansas Mafia pressured those outlets to cancel their orders. I'm sure that they were correct in their suspicions.

[Venus de Smilo]

So because everyone here is convinced that the Clintons would kill, the facts don't matter?

I guess you believe OJ didn't kill Ron and Nicole because a racist, dumber-than-dead jury found him not guilty? You remind me of the OJ trial juror who, after the trial was over, said that a lot of people have the same DNA.

[gnome]

I guess you believe OJ didn't kill Ron and Nicole because a racist, dumber-than-dead jury found him not guilty? You remind me of the OJ trial juror who, after the trial was over, said that a lot of people have the same DNA.

Not sure where you get that. I'm objecting to people's opinion of Clinton becoming part of the evidence that he murdered.

[Maggie_T]

(shaking head) I confess that the devotion and loyalty that the Klintoons inspire in some people astonishes me. I never saw anything quite like it ... no, wait ... now that I remember, Charles Manson, the Heavensgate bloke, Jim Jones, etc. inspired the same kind of devotion in their followers.

Cult-like. That's the word that comes to mind. Scary.

[Jack_Savage]

Not sure where you get that. I'm objecting to people's opinion of Clinton becoming part of the evidence that he murdered.
But its true. Its all true. Think about it. Ms. Willey, Juanita, and all the others that we just haven't found out about yet. A serial abuser.

Look, Bill Clinton is responsible for what people think of him. He could have acted like John Wayne and we would see him totally different, but noooo, he had to act like that total jerk-off, Bill Clinton. He likes to manipulate society from that feeling sorry for himself act. Hillary calling what he did a vast right-wing conspiracy.

You don't actually eat that crap he sells do you?

If you were the kind of person who really felt his pain, you would consider those who were molested by him. What has he done to lead you to conclude murder is beyond his reach? What?

What kind of person creates a goon squad of government agents to set up his marks?? What are the people really like who spin false stories about Paula Jones and Jennifer Flowers? Who would do it except in some futuristic nightmare halloween movie, until Clintons time came? Who. Would you do it for Bill Clinton, if so under what circumstance, and if not why? What do you find repulsive about doing what his advisors are eager to do. What is the difference between you and them?

Its hard for me to believe your concerned while at the same time not concerned one bit about the women he took down. Not one bit concerned about the missiles he shot off to deflect the publicity. Those who say they don't believe all those women who confronted their fears to speak out, really do disgust me, especially when I realize that it is so shallow and only a convenient excuse to hide from facing the truth about themselves, not about any personal ideals.

Anyone who votes for Hillary will have a mortal sin on their soul. They will have to answer for eternity the same judgment that the Clintons must face. For what? To be sophmorically right like some high school friday night game or voting for the prom king and queen?

Its nuts. The place real evil comes from. A need to be right above all else.

I haven't read your other posts so maybe I am missing something and misjudged you. If so then I apoligize, but please clarify for me the difference between you and those who support the left-wing Sun-God.

[HomeschoolrsRUs]

(shaking head) I confess that the devotion and loyalty that the Klintoons inspire in some people astonishes me. I never saw anything quite like it ... no, wait ... now that I remember, Charles Manson, the Heavensgate bloke, Jim Jones, etc. inspired the same kind of devotion in their followers.

Cult-like. That's the word that comes to mind. Scary.

Sis, that is what I've always thought too! It's that great-minds thing at work again, :biggrin:

[Maggie_T]

LOL. I know. :biggrin:

And the fact that the Klintoons' followers go out of their way to defend the indefensible underscores what I said.

D4R, that must be one of your best rants, mate. :thumb:

Exasperating, isn't it. I remember when feminists were pressured about Hillary, Queen of Feminists, "standing by her man." All of a sudden, all these a-woman-needs-a-husband-like-a-fish-needs-a-bicycle harridans made a complete turn and became Stepford Wives. "She's devoted to her marriage," they simpered prettily to the cameras.

Do you realize that because of that, feminazis forever lost whatever shred of credibility they had? And the cows still defend the Clintons!

If that is not cult-like devotion, nothing is.

[Maggie_T]

Why, thank you very much, D4R. I really appreciate that. http://freeconservatives.com/smilies/bashful.gif

Unfortunately, it gets me nowhere with libs. The more you confront them with facts, the more they put their hands over their ears and shout LALALALALALA!!!!

They're quite hopeless.

[dPrasse]

....You do have a genuine talent for cutting right to the bone. Digging past all the fat dumb and happy con, showing the truth. ....

That is why I try to stay on her good side ...:biggrin:

[Venus de Smilo]

Not sure where you get that. I'm objecting to people's opinion of Clinton becoming part of the evidence that he murdered.

No, you weren't, and nobody suggested that their opinion is evidence. You're spinning now.

There isn't a lick of difference between your spin now and the 'rats trying to spin away Hitliary calling General Petraeus a liar (...willing suspension of disbelief") and Kerry insulting the troops ("Stay in school and work hard or else you'll end up in Iraq").

[The_Elucidator]

No, you weren't, and nobody suggested that their opinion is evidence. You're spinning now.

There isn't a lick of difference between your spin now and the 'rats trying to spin away Hitliary calling General Petraeus a liar (...willing suspension of disbelief") and Kerry insulting the troops ("Stay in school and work hard or else you'll end up in Iraq").

That's why we love Venus!!! Now we could delve into his drug abuse, that would really get the Klintoon apologists going... :evilgrin:

[Jester21]

nobody suggested that their opinion is evidence.
I think the issue here is that people are passing off their opinions without offering any (real) evidence to back up where they come from. That's what he was pointing out.

[The_Elucidator]

I think the issue here is that people are passing off their opinions without offering any (real) evidence to back up where they come from. That's what he was pointing out.

That may be the perception but not the reality. In reality what we have are lefties that completely gloss over all the evidence posted in prior threads, they (meaning you) butt into the water cooler conversation between conservatives who have already discussed said issue at length and say, oh yeah, prove it! :rolleyes:

[Jester21]

Well if you don't want to post evidence, just say so. Nobody's holding a gun to your head. I was under the impression that some people here anyway enjoy a bit of debate. I do.

[Maggie_T]

What evidence? The Clintons are infamous for not remembering evidence (Hillary in particular has an astonishingly weak memory when convenient), hiding evidence, twisting evidence ("that depends on what the meaning of is is"), distorting evidence ("it's all a vast right-wing conspiracy").

C'mon, Jester. You, like us, have heard it all. Never mind how much evidence we can give you, you'll come up with a Clintonesque justification for it (any of the above-mentioned).

[The_Elucidator]

Well if you don't want to post evidence, just say so. Nobody's holding a gun to your head. I was under the impression that some people here anyway enjoy a bit of debate. I do.

The debate gets quite cumbersome when everyone involved isn't quite up to speed and we have to nurse them along.

[Jester21]

Never mind how much evidence we can give you, you'll come up with a Clintonesque justification for it
Try me. I think you'll find me quite reasonable should you show something that is beyond vague, extremely circumstantial evidence.

The debate gets quite cumbersome when everyone involved isn't quite up to speed and we have to nurse them along.
Or when people start poking holes in conspiracy theories.

[Timberwolf]

I think the issue here is that people are passing off their opinions without offering any (real) evidence to back up where they come from. That's what he was pointing out.
I guess you forgot about the following offering from Doc:

In 1999, a lady named Gretchen Glass wrote a long, detailed, deeply researched 5-part series called Presidential Treason 1-5. It's attached as a ZIP file that contains three DOC files. Let the Clinton apologists read it and then see if they're still eager to excuse that son of a bitch.
<!-- / message --><!-- attachments --><FIELDSET class=fieldset><LEGEND>Attached Files</LEGEND><TABLE cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>http://www.freeconservatives.com/vb/images/attach/zip.gif</TD><TD>PrezTreason.zip (http://www.freeconservatives.com/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=1703&d=1189877190) (87.6 KB, 5 views)</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></FIELDSET>
Seems to be a pattern in his actions while PotUS...and those that did "play ball" went to prison...those who didn't died.

[Jack_Savage]

I think the issue here is that people are passing off their opinions without offering any (real) evidence to back up where they come from. That's what he was pointing out.
Talking from some personal experience finally eh Jester.

[gnome]

Could someone "nurse me along" about the snopes rebuttal? Nobody seems to want to point to any specific facts in their story which are untrue.

All I've heard is that snopes can't be trusted because they have a liberal bias.

Which doesn't really explain the presence of articles debunking false statements about conservatives, or This (http://www.snopes.com/politics/crime/jena6.asp) article about the Jena incident which passes by the opportunity to assume a blindly leftist outrage.

[Seabee]

Oh Boy!! Don't open the Jena file, save it for another day. Lol, with all the Soros and Clinton arguing lets make it past that first.

[Maggie_T]

Jester has left the building so gnome thinks he should fill in for him. :rolleyes:

[Venus de Smilo]

What evidence? The Clintons are infamous for not remembering evidence (Hillary in particular has an astonishingly weak memory when convenient), hiding evidence, twisting evidence ("that depends on what the meaning of is is"), distorting evidence ("it's all a vast right-wing conspiracy").

C'mon, Jester. You, like us, have heard it all. Never mind how much evidence we can give you, you'll come up with a Clintonesque justification for it (any of the above-mentioned).

That's why it's such a gross waste of time to give lefties so much as the time of day.

If Jes really wanted to know, s/he would look it up, either on this forum or other places on the 'net. Why in God's name would any of us want to waste our time looking it up FOR him/her? Lefties are just too stupid to learn factual matter. This wouldn't be a good time to do it, even if we wanted to. Such people will be busy these days scurrying to Columbia University to swoon at Ahmajerkoff's feet.

[Venus de Smilo]

The debate gets quite cumbersome when everyone involved isn't quite up to speed and we have to nurse them along.
Such people are too busy sucking off the government teet to respond to productive nursing.:D

[Venus de Smilo]

I think the issue here is that people are passing off their opinions without offering any (real) evidence to back up where they come from. That's what he was pointing out.
No, it wasn't. Read his post again. His statement was perfectly clear, and your effort to spin it is no better than his was.

Lame.

[Rhino]

I think the issue here is that people are passing off their opinions without offering any (real) evidence to back up where they come from.Yeah, sort of like claiming the White House lied about Iraq.

[Jester21]

Yeah, sort of like claiming the White House lied about Iraq.
lol

As if they haven't backed away from WMDs as the main reason for invading.

[Jack_Savage]

lol

As if they haven't backed away from WMDs as the main reason for invading.
What is it you find funny about that?

[Rhino]

He has to find it funny. As long as he continues to claim WMD was the reason, he can claim they lied. Since such a claim is the centerpiece of many of his arguments, he can't allow himself to acknowledge facts that prove it wrong.

[Jester21]

As long as he continues to claim WMD was the reason, he can claim they lied.
It was the reason. I'm guessing even you guys thought that was the big reason. How old is this forum? Does it go back to 2002?

[Rhino]

Yes, it does, and this was discussed back then too. I'm not sure if those threads still exist, but feel free to search for them. I'm also not sure if they'd even be in the same board software, so searching may not be very accurate.

[Naturalized-Texan]

It was the reason. I'm guessing even you guys thought that was the big reason. How old is this forum? Does it go back to 2002?
Since you've been here you've been making the claim that President Bush lied, yet you have NEVER provided even the tiniest shred of evidence to back up your claim. Consequently, one is forced to conclude that you are merely parroting the Big Lie Propaganda from far leftists like MoveOn.org, the "mainstream" media, and the Democrat leadership.

Since you claim that President Bush lied, you are obligated to provide proof of that claim from an UNBIASED source. Put up, or shut up!

[Venus de Smilo]

lol

As if they haven't backed away from WMDs as the main reason for invading.
1-4-4-1

[Timberwolf]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">As long as he continues to claim WMD was the reason, he can claim they lied. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
It was the reason. I'm guessing even you guys thought that was the big reason. How old is this forum? Does it go back to 2002?

Disarming Iraq (http://www.heritage.org/Research/Iraq/bg1608.cfm#pgfId-1010941)

UN Security Council Resolutions Concerning Iraq (http://www.state.gov/p/nea/rls/01fs/14906.htm)