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Pennville_Bill
07-21-2002, 10:41 PM
A few thoughts on things military, roused by hype about our recent access of patriotism for the War on Terrorism, and maybe by one too many war documentaries on late-night television.

(1) Men seldom enlist from patriotism. They enlist in time of peace because they are bored, need a job, dream of travel, don't know what else to do with themselves, want to prove their manhood, or have heard lurid tales about the women in Hong Kong. Patriotism is at best an afterthought.

In time of war, reasons again vary. Some enlist to get the service least likely to see combat. During Viet Nam, the National Guard was popular for just this reason. Gutsier men will join because they want to see combat. They simply like the action. Some of these later become correspondents, and go from war to war. A few men, the ones who adhere to the elite commando outfits, carry with them an intense and angry aggressiveness for which they seek a acceptable outlet. They want to kill people.

None of this is patriotism. Nor is it a desire to save the world from communism, national socialism, slavery, or the misbehavior of the Japanese. The truth is that people do not care greatly about unpleasant political systems in places they have never seen. Truth, virtue, and morality are add-ons convenient for explaining things done for less noble reasons.

(2) Most men actively do not want to fight for their country, and will go to great lengths to avoid it. That is why in serious wars we need a draft. After the war, draftees may find it socially useful to discover that they were inspired by patriotism.

(3) Soldiers often have not the slightest idea why they are fighting. Oddly, they don't seem to care.

I doubt that one enlisted man in fifty could have found Viet Nam on a map. Nor could have much of the public on whose behalf they were said to be fighting. Few soldiers knew what communism was, other than a darkly threatening Very Bad Thing. Few could spell it, nor did they care. Books were available. They didn't read them. Nor, usually, did the public. Soldiers didn't care in the least whether the Vietnamese, whom they generally hated, lived under communism.

(4) Draftees go to war not because they are brave, but because they are not brave enough. It takes courage to volunteer for war. It takes courage, or at least decisiveness, to hide in Mexico. It does not take courage to be drafted. This is why it works. The draft relies on the principle that at each step, from reporting for training to getting irrevocably on the troop ship, it is easier to cooperate than to resist. A draftee may fight bravely. Yet he wouldn't have gone unless compelled.

(5) Much of America does not like its soldiers, or its military. The upper classes hold servicemen in contempt. The Ivy Leagues for example provide almost no volunteers. Parents near bases often forbid their daughters to date servicemen. Our grade schools expel boys for drawing soldiers. At the end of a successful war a maimed GI may get a week of drinks bought for him, but after that he just makes people uncomfortable. Veterans of Korea were ignored. Those from Vietnam were often despised.

(6) In democracies, prosecution of war depends on hiding the nature of war. On the History Channel we endlessly see the bombers of WWII flying over Europe, to stirring music, amid clouds pocked with flak, turrets blazing at incoming Messerschmitts. Bombs fall, flash-flash-flash, across the remote city below. It's an adrenal rush, exciting, and calls to something deep in the audience.

You don't see little Hans, far below and four years old, screaming because something wet and messy is oozing from Mommy's head and her eyes are funny and the fire is getting closer and why doesn't someone help him? Nor do you see the turret gunner with his intestines hanging out like greasy rope and blood pooling in low spots.

The anger such observations arouse in many military men is a dead giveaway of their discomfort. Governments know that if people saw much of this, they might not fight.


(7) American wars often begin, through unprepared ness and simple stupidity, with the pointless sacrifice of countless troops, which is usually explained as springing from the perfidy of the enemy. In WWI, WWII, and Korea we were utterly unready. Pearl Harbor occurred because we didn't bother to track the Japanese fleet.

Having bled our soldiers profusely because of inattention, we congratulate ourselves on winning in the long run. Stirring music again accompanies the congratulation.

( Officers, characterized by physical rather than moral courage, usually seem more interested in protecting their careers than the lives of their men. They will assault a beach, but won't open their mouths. The higher the rank, the more they behave like cheap politicians. I saw this many times when I covered the military.

For example, a pilot once wrote me saying that certain social policies were gravely damaging the capacity of his service to fight and would lead, in a serious war, to substantial military incapacity and loss of life. He then said for God's sake not to use his name or identify his unit. CYA. The same pilot flew many missions over Baghdad.

(9) After a war, veterans often dislike their own country more intensely than they do the enemy. A soldier goes to war, perhaps encouraged by martial bands and splendid uniforms, to fight someone he is told is the enemy. He returns missing a leg, wearing a colostomy bag, or remembering things that it is better not to remember.

He then finds that people at home have been partying and living the good life while he was bleeding, that they don't really care about him, that some laugh at him for having been stupid enough to go. And he no longer has anything in common with them. An impassable gulf separates him from the country.

Year by year as the war recedes, its apparent importance diminishes. The enemy, like as not, suddenly becomes an ally. Yet the soldier still has the colostomy bag, still sits in the wheelchair. He feels used by the happy people who stayed at home, decides that he was had, that somebody, he's not sure just who, maybe the whole country, played him for a sucker.

And he hates them for it.

©Fred Reed 2002
Fred on Everything (http://www.fredoneverything.net/MilReflections.html)

//NOTE TO FC ADMIN: Fred Reed has given consent for his material to be duplicated provided his © accompanys the posting. - PB//

DesertFox
07-21-2002, 11:16 PM
Bill, need the link, buddy.

Pennville_Bill
07-22-2002, 12:02 AM
Done

Desertrat06
07-22-2002, 07:09 AM
We need more Fred Reeds around, preferably writing for the NYTimes or the WashPost. Or in a federal job having veto power over decisions by agencies of whatever stripe--but particularly the Homeland Security Direktorate.

Long as I'm dreaming: We need a Hackworth in a similar position with the SecDef.

A Citizens' Omsbudman, with plenipotentiary powers, and a big rubber stamp which sez, "You can't do that. It's stoopid."

Like a fella once said, "I have a dream..."

'Rat

Pennville_Bill
07-22-2002, 11:46 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>We need more Fred Reeds around, preferably writing for the NYTimes or the WashPost. Or in a federal job having veto power over decisions by agencies of whatever stripe--but particularly the Homeland Security Direktorate.

Long as I'm dreaming: We need a Hackworth in a similar position with the SecDef.

A Citizens' Omsbudman, with plenipotentiary powers, and a big rubber stamp which sez, "You can't do that. It's stoopid."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree. Fred is one of a kind and he usually nails his topic dead on.

DesertFox
07-22-2002, 02:01 PM
Just so, Guy. Fred and Hack both get onto a theme and get carried away. I wouldn't want either in authority, as they strike me as being as interested in getting attention as in fixing things; but they'd be excellent in Inspector General roles in the organizations mentioned by the Desertrat.

Desertrat06
07-22-2002, 02:50 PM
Fox, I follow your point about getting attention.

However, it's rather difficult to get things fixed in today's US of A unless you're either 1. Already on the inside; or, 2. Raising hell and getting attention. And those on the inside aren't usually wired in to correcting things. Their 'fix' is already in, which is how they got on the inside in the first place. images/icons/grin.gif

The IG idea makes sense, though...

'Rat

**DONOTDELETE**
07-22-2002, 04:01 PM
First time I've read him, that was very interesting to read. Looking around his site some now..

Thanks.

Dano

corlorde
07-22-2002, 04:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>(1) Men seldom enlist from patriotism. They enlist in time of peace because they are bored, need a job, dream of travel, don't know what else to do with themselves, want to prove their manhood, or have heard lurid tales about the women in Hong Kong. Patriotism is at best an afterthought.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I see the nattering nabobs of negativism are out in full force again.

I don’t really care for the tone here. The military is a viable career path for kids who:
A) Don’t want to go to college yet; or don’t have the funds to attend higher education so the Military offers a reward for serving. B) I found the military was an excellent “out” for street kids who were heading down the “wrong road” and wanted to “make something" of themselves.

I joined the military because I was hanging around the wrong crowd, and wanted to travel. The thought of being able to travel around the world, get college money, and jump out of airplanes to boot, seemed better at 18, them sitting back in a classroom for another four years.


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>(2) Most men actively do not want to fight for their country, and will go to great lengths to avoid it. That is why in serious wars we need a draft. After the war, draftees may find it socially useful to discover that they were inspired by patriotism.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bull plucky. Being a combat vet myself, the reason we “fight” is the guy to your left, and the guy to your right. The squad, platoon, or rifle company is a family. We trained for a variety of different reasons. It isn’t all just “fighting” but peacekeeping, deterrence, and yes a political tool.

You want talks? You want negotiations? Send diplomats. Do you want an airfield secure? Send in the Ranger Regiment to kick in doors and shoot people in the face.


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>(3) Soldiers often have not the slightest idea why they are fighting. Oddly, they don't seem to care.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not so much nowadays. The units are very aware what’s going on and very much involved in the decision making process. That’s what makes our military so effective junior mint.


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>(5) Much of America does not like its soldiers, or its military<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah, contraire kimosabi! I’m not sure what part of “America” you are referring too, (Berkeley?!) but I see active support of our military everywhere!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>(6) In democracies, prosecution of war depends on hiding the nature of war.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry, can’t see the moot point here. The author has an uncanny ability of pointing out the obvious.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>(9) After a war, veterans often dislike their own country more intensely than they do the enemy.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Maybe. I was in Mogadishu Somalia and I personally wanted to kill Clinton for not giving us the required tools to complete the mission. It’s almost always the half hearted ramblings of peacenickery politicians that causes this anger in our vets. If we are going to unleash the best army in the world, let’s do it with overwhelming firepower and ALL the tools necessary to accomplish the mission.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>He returns missing a leg, wearing a colostomy bag, or remembering things that it is better not to remember.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, since I’m a paralyzed vet in a wheelchair, injured on active duty, I cannot be prouder than the fact that I served my country to the best of my ability. The Army has taken great care of me and my family thank you very much. Instead of the half truths and blanket statements, maybe you should “get on down to the VA” and ask some of our warriors how they feel ..”Nobody loves a soldier until the enemy is at the gate” The failure of our chattering classes to recognize the breathtaking extent of American power is in large part because they know absolutely nothing about matters military, and show little inclination to learn.
But there is another reason. To recognize American power is also to recognize American forbearance. We could conquer the world if we chose to do so. Almost any other nation, put in our circumstances, would.
That we haven't is proof of what galls our elites most: We're the good guys.
The Talking heads- empty shirt -"doom and gloom" crowd who were very vocal in the begining of the war, are now nowhere to be found. Credit is due to our military men and women in uniform and the leadership of our Non Commisioned officers.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>And he hates them for it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not me brother….This we’ll defend” http://corlordesplace.homestead.com/files/driveforce.jpg

DesertFox
07-22-2002, 04:53 PM
Excellent post, corlorde.

Maggie_T
07-22-2002, 05:20 PM
Corlorde, thank you very much for your post and thank you even more for your service to our country.

I'm surprised at Fred. As GOTW said, it's unusually bitter.

Now I consider myself to be pretty cynical at times. Especially when it comes to politics. But I'll always cheer the corlodes or this world rather than the Freds (though I admit I usually like Fred's articles).

**DONOTDELETE**
07-23-2002, 12:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>
(9) After a war, veterans often dislike their own country more intensely than they do the enemy. A soldier goes to war, perhaps encouraged by martial bands and splendid uniforms, to fight someone he is told is the enemy. He returns missing a leg, wearing a colostomy bag, or remembering things that it is better not to remember.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This sounds unusually bitter. Most veterans (WW2, Korea and Vietnam) certainly have no love of war but are intensley patriotic. Fred is extrapolating too much from the negatives of the Vietnam War.